TEDxMidAtlantic
Ethan Lindenberger: Why we need to fight misinformation about vaccines
伊森．林登伯格: 為什麼我們必須挺身對抗疫苗接種的錯誤訊息
Filmed:
Readability: 4.3
1,819,166 views
伊森 ‧ 林登伯格自孩提起從未接受過疫苗接種。有一天，他在紅迪上發布了一個簡單的問題：「哪邊可以接種疫苗？」這則發文猶如病毒般擴散，使得林登伯格置身於疫苗這項熱門議題的核心，最後，甚至使他站上美國參議院。不出一年，這位高中生回顧這段備受矚目、令人出乎意料的時光，以及由他帶動的對抗錯誤訊息運動並主張捍衛科學真相。
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
作為開頭，我想向你們分享我的家鄉
00:12
To start, I want to share with you guys
something about my hometown
something about my hometown
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俄亥俄州，諾瓦克市
00:16
of Norwalk, Ohio.
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好了，如前所述，我來自諾瓦克市
00:17
Now, as this video stated,
I am from Norwalk,
I am from Norwalk,
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00:19
which is an extremely small town,
about 15,000 people.
about 15,000 people.
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那是一個非常小的城鎮
大約一萬五千的人口數
大約一萬五千的人口數
00:22
And really, in Norwalk,
if you want to do something fun,
if you want to do something fun,
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說真的，在諾瓦克，如果想找些樂子
00:25
you go to Walmart or drive half an hour
to something more interesting.
to something more interesting.
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可以逛逛沃爾瑪超市
或是開半個小時車找更有趣的事做
或是開半個小時車找更有趣的事做
在諾瓦克，我從小到大生長的地方
00:28
And for Norwalk, I've lived there
for my entire life,
for my entire life,
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00:31
I'm a senior at the local
public high school,
public high school,
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我就讀當地公立高中
00:34
and you know, it's something
to where I really enjoy my small town.
to where I really enjoy my small town.
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你知道，這地方真的很棒
我真的很喜歡我的小鎮
我真的很喜歡我的小鎮
我就像一般的孩子，你知道
00:37
And I'm just a normal kid, you know,
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帶領辯論社團
00:39
I lead debate clubs,
I volunteer at my church.
I volunteer at my church.
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在教堂擔任志工
00:42
And back in November of 2018,
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回到 2018 年 11 月時
00:45
I made a small Reddit post
asking for advice
asking for advice
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我在紅迪發布一則貼文
希望大家給我一點建議
希望大家給我一點建議
00:47
on an issue that I was encountering
that I needed some clarification on.
that I needed some clarification on.
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當時我面臨一個議題
需要有人幫我釐清
需要有人幫我釐清
00:52
And this issue, as was stated
in the introduction,
in the introduction,
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這個議題，如同介紹時所述
00:54
was something towards vaccinations
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是有關接種疫苗
00:56
and how I was not immunized
against various diseases,
against various diseases,
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以及我沒有接種各種疫苗的原因
00:59
including polio and measles,
as well as influenza, HPV, hepatitis --
as well as influenza, HPV, hepatitis --
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包含小兒麻痺症以及麻疹
還有流感、HPV、肝炎
還有流感、HPV、肝炎
01:03
the standard vaccine
someone my age would receive.
someone my age would receive.
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這些我這個年紀的人可能接種的疫苗
01:06
Now, this question I asked
was simple and pretty strange,
was simple and pretty strange,
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好了，我發布的問題很簡單也很奇怪
01:10
because, you know,
I wanted to get vaccinated.
I wanted to get vaccinated.
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因為，是的，我想要接種疫苗
01:12
That's kind of weird, but it happened,
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這有點怪，但事情就這樣發生了
01:14
and then this turned into a public story,
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接著這件事就變成一個公眾議題
01:16
because I wanted to get vaccinated.
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就因為我想要接種疫苗
01:18
So that was kind of strange,
and then it blew up more,
and then it blew up more,
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那有點奇怪，而事件繼續延燒
01:21
and I was doing interviews
and talking to more people,
and talking to more people,
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我開始接受訪問並與許多人談話
01:24
and again, I'm a normal kid,
I'm not a scientist,
I'm not a scientist,
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我再重申一次，我是個
一般的孩子，不是科學家
一般的孩子，不是科學家
01:26
I don't lead a non-profit,
I am a pretty casual person,
I am a pretty casual person,
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沒有帶領非營利組織
我就是個一般人
我就是個一般人
01:29
I'm wearing a hoodie.
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我現在甚至穿著連帽衣呢
01:31
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
01:33
Because of this question and this story,
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由於我的問題以及這整件事
01:36
because I wanted to get vaccinated
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由於我想接種疫苗
01:38
and this interesting situation I was in,
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以及當時我所處的有趣情勢
01:39
I saw that I quickly was
in this public setting
in this public setting
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我發現，我一下就處於
發生這極為重要的議題
以及爭辯的公開場合中
以及爭辯的公開場合中
01:42
of an extremely important controversy
and discussion taking place.
and discussion taking place.
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01:46
Now, I saw that the stories and headlines
were pretty accurate for most part,
were pretty accurate for most part,
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我看見的報導和頭條
大部分都非常正確
大部分都非常正確
你知道，「挺身對抗反疫苗母親
01:50
you know, "After defying anti-vax mom,
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01:52
Ohio teen expresses
why he got vaccinated."
why he got vaccinated."
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俄亥俄州青年解釋
為什麼要接種疫苗。」
為什麼要接種疫苗。」
01:54
Pretty accurate, pretty true.
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非常正確，非常真實
01:56
And, as stated, I testified
in front of a Senate committee,
in front of a Senate committee,
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而且，如敘述，我在
參議院委員會前作證時
參議院委員會前作證時
事情是這樣，他們說
01:59
so there, they said,
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「這個自己去施打疫苗的年輕人
02:00
"This teen who self-vaccinated
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02:02
just ripped his mom's anti-vaxer beliefs
in front of Congress."
in front of Congress."
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在國會前粉碎他媽媽
反對施打疫苗的信念。」
反對施打疫苗的信念。」
02:05
OK, I didn't really do that,
but that's fine.
but that's fine.
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好，我並沒有真的
那樣做，不過沒關係
那樣做，不過沒關係
02:08
And certain news outlets
took it a little further.
took it a little further.
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而且某些新聞扯得更遠
02:13
"'God knows how I'm still alive':
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「『天曉得我怎麼還活著』：
02:14
Teenager, 18, finally gets vaccinated
and attacks his anti-vax parents."
and attacks his anti-vax parents."
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這個 18 歲的年輕人終於接種疫苗
並抨擊他反疫苗的父母。」
並抨擊他反疫苗的父母。」
02:20
So I did not attack my parents,
that's not accurate at all.
that's not accurate at all.
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我才沒有抨擊父母
那報導根本不確實
那報導根本不確實
02:23
And you know, really,
my story was more about controversy.
my story was more about controversy.
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那真的將我的故事報導成爭議
02:27
It was about how my mom
was bad and I was good,
was bad and I was good,
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像是我媽很壞以及我很善良
02:30
and I was ripping her a new one.
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而且我對她展開嚴厲的批判
這些都不是真的
02:32
Not true.
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這些都沒有發生
02:33
Not what was happening.
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我從來不對我媽不禮貌
02:34
I never was rude towards my mother,
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02:36
and even in public settings
where I expressed
where I expressed
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甚至在公眾場合
我解釋她的理念是被誤導時
02:38
how her beliefs were misinformed,
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02:40
I said that she was a loving mother,
and that's important to understand.
and that's important to understand.
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我會強調，重要的是一定要了解
她是個慈愛的媽媽
她是個慈愛的媽媽
02:44
Because a lot of people, I think,
in the scientific community
in the scientific community
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因為很多人，我認為
身處科學界中的人
身處科學界中的人
了解疫苗的重要性
02:46
that understand
why vaccines are so important,
why vaccines are so important,
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會對不願接種疫苗的人不解
02:49
can really be confused
by someone who would not vaccinate.
by someone who would not vaccinate.
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確實，這就像有人
拒絕送小朋友去急診室
拒絕送小朋友去急診室
02:51
Really, we can compare it to someone
not taking their child to the ER.
not taking their child to the ER.
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身處在這種環境之下非常危險
02:55
That's a very dangerous situation to be in
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這也顯示，在某些層面
少了對孩子的那份同理心
少了對孩子的那份同理心
02:57
and it shows some lack of empathy
towards your children in some regards.
towards your children in some regards.
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說真的，我能明白這些，我可以
03:00
And really, I can understand that, I can.
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03:02
But my mom, she was misinformed
and misled by sources that convinced her
and misled by sources that convinced her
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但是我媽受到一些消息誤導，
這些消息說服她慈愛的父母
是不會讓孩子接種疫苗的
是不會讓孩子接種疫苗的
03:07
that if she was a loving parent,
she wouldn't vaccinate.
she wouldn't vaccinate.
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03:10
Now, when I encountered this
and I talked to my mom,
and I talked to my mom,
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而，當我無意間得知
這件事時，我與我媽談
這件事時，我與我媽談
03:13
it didn't obviously go well at first,
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一開始並不是非常順利
03:15
because I was wanting to do something
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因為我想做的事
她認為這件事會使我
罹患自閉症或導致終身殘廢
罹患自閉症或導致終身殘廢
03:17
that she thought would either cause autism
or maim me for the rest of my life,
or maim me for the rest of my life,
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我卻說我想接種，結果行不通
03:21
and I said I wanted to do this --
didn't really fly,
didn't really fly,
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進展也不順利
03:23
didn't really go well.
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不過我發現有一件有趣的事
03:24
But the thing that I found interesting
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03:26
was that when I had started
to get into this circumstance,
to get into this circumstance,
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當我身處某些情境
03:29
do these interviews,
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接受這些訪談時
我總有一個問題
03:30
there was one question I proposed.
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雖然不是有建設性的問題：
03:32
Wasn't a positive one:
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我究竟給自己招惹了甚麼
03:33
What in the world
have I gotten myself into?
have I gotten myself into?
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我不斷問自己
03:35
That's what I asked constantly,
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因為，再一次重申，我並非
專業人士，只是一般的孩子
專業人士，只是一般的孩子
03:37
because, again, I am not an expert,
I am a normal kid,
I am a normal kid,
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但現在我卻不斷在 CNN
以及福斯新聞上討論科學議題
以及福斯新聞上討論科學議題
03:40
and now I'm talking to CNN and Fox News
about a scientific discussion
about a scientific discussion
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那真的是，我該繼續下去嗎？
該繼續發表意見嗎？
該繼續發表意見嗎？
03:43
that really, should I be facilitating,
should I be commenting on?
should I be commenting on?
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很多人對此感到質疑
他們有非常正當的理由
他們有非常正當的理由
03:47
And a lot of people questioned that,
and for good reason.
and for good reason.
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不過，我不對不懂的事發表言論
03:50
But I never claimed things
I didn't understand,
I didn't understand,
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03:52
I talked about my personal experiences.
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我所說的都與我個人經驗有關
在參議院公聽會中
03:54
And even at the Senate hearing,
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03:56
I just talked about
how misinformation is dangerous.
how misinformation is dangerous.
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我也只提到到錯誤的訊息有多麼危險
我媽從社群媒體上得到
許多看法，不論是臉書
許多看法，不論是臉書
03:58
My mom got a lot of her beliefs
from social media, from Facebook
from social media, from Facebook
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或是一些單位，他們使用的
平台尚未禁止發布不實的言論
平台尚未禁止發布不實的言論
04:01
and from organizations that were allowing
their platforms to push lies
their platforms to push lies
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那些言論非常危險
04:05
that were very dangerous.
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04:06
Now, I also saw that
as I was doing this --
as I was doing this --
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在我發表言論同時我也看見
類似情形發生在我身上
類似情形發生在我身上
04:08
and I was doing this
as respectfully as I could,
as respectfully as I could,
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我盡我所能展現尊重
及保持正確性
04:11
as accurately as I could --
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有許多對我的批評
許多對我感到非常生氣的人
許多對我感到非常生氣的人
04:12
I was getting a lot of criticism,
a lot of very angry people.
a lot of very angry people.
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04:15
When I was in DC
for that testimony I gave,
for that testimony I gave,
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為了提供證詞，我到華盛頓特區
04:17
I was looking around the office building
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我記得，當我在辦公大樓閒晃時
04:19
and three ladies
got in an elevator with me
got in an elevator with me
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有三位女士跟我一起搭乘電梯
他們說我是導致他們孩子
殘廢和死亡的元兇
殘廢和死亡的元兇
04:21
and said I'm the reason their children
are being maimed and murdered
are being maimed and murdered
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我跟希特勒沒有兩樣
04:25
and I'm basically Hitler.
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04:26
So that was fun.
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有趣吧
04:27
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
04:29
So really, for most circumstances,
for most teenagers and most people,
for most teenagers and most people,
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真的，大部分的情況下
大多數的青少年及大多數的人
大多數的青少年及大多數的人
04:34
when they get criticized,
it leads to doubt.
it leads to doubt.
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受到批判時，都會開始懷疑
04:36
And that doubt leads to questioning,
and that questioning leads to quitting.
and that questioning leads to quitting.
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懷疑會引發質疑，而質疑會讓人放棄
04:40
Because, when you have a topic
that you're interested in,
that you're interested in,
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你感興趣的議題
04:43
or a movement that you want
to be a part of,
to be a part of,
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或是想參與的行動出現時
04:46
and you're taking a stance
and saying what's true,
and saying what's true,
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你表明立場並捍衛真理
04:48
good idea is don't avoid criticism.
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因為良好的理念不怕他人的批評
04:50
And for especially young people,
they have a hard time dealing with that,
they have a hard time dealing with that,
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對於特別年輕的人來說
面對這類的事情總是顯得棘手
面對這類的事情總是顯得棘手
04:53
and these important discussions
that need young people to take a part in,
that need young people to take a part in,
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這些需要年輕人參與討論的重要議題
需投入許多心力
04:57
it takes a lot of commitment.
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我不是在誇耀自己是多麼棒
但接下來重點來了
但接下來重點來了
04:58
I'm not saying that I'm amazing,
but here's what's important:
but here's what's important:
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05:01
through me joining this movement
and this important scientific discussion,
and this important scientific discussion,
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透過我參與這項行動
以及這項重要的科學探討
以及這項重要的科學探討
這些事情發生了
05:05
here's what happened.
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臉書的平台不一樣了
05:06
Facebook changed their platform.
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他們改變方式處理反疫苗相關內容
05:08
They were going to change
how they approach anti-vax content.
how they approach anti-vax content.
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亞馬遜甚至將自閉症
和疫苗接種資訊有誤的書下架
和疫苗接種資訊有誤的書下架
05:11
Amazon even removed misinformed
books about autism and vaccines.
books about autism and vaccines.
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就在最近，GoFundMe
取消了反接種疫苗的活動
取消了反接種疫苗的活動
05:14
And recently, GoFundMe took down
anti-vax campaigns.
anti-vax campaigns.
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05:16
We're talking about how movements
like this are causing actual change,
like this are causing actual change,
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我們所說的是經由這類行動
如何造成實質上的改變
如何造成實質上的改變
05:20
actually impacting the way
this game is played
this game is played
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影響賽局的進行
影響騙人的錯誤訊息
05:22
and the misinformation
that's lying to people
that's lying to people
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影響說服人們的危險想法
05:24
and convincing them
of very dangerous ideas.
of very dangerous ideas.
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05:26
Now, before I leave, because I only have
a short amount of time,
a short amount of time,
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現在，我只剩一小段時間就結束了
我想請你們將一件重要的事牢記心中
05:30
I want to give you one
important thing to keep in mind.
important thing to keep in mind.
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這件事遠比其他事情來的重要
05:32
One important takeaway from this all.
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你可以做些甚麼以及我做過甚麼
05:34
What you can do and what I did.
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05:36
I didn't do amazing research and studies
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我沒有嘔心瀝血的調查以及研究
05:40
and take information
and present it to people;
and present it to people;
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沒有得到資訊並呈現給人們
我沒有與他人進行艱深
05:42
I didn't have deep, intellectual,
scientific debates with people.
scientific debates with people.
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費盡心思的科學探討
05:45
All I did was share my story.
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我只是將我的故事分享出去
05:47
And that's enough for most people:
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對大部分的人來說已經足夠了
去了解一些傳聞
資料之外的真實人物
資料之外的真實人物
05:49
to understand the anecdotal experiences,
the real people behind the data.
the real people behind the data.
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05:54
Because data doesn't resonate with people.
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因為資料不會與人產生共鳴
但人會與人產生共鳴
05:56
People resonate with people.
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你們必須在心中牢記這點
05:57
And you have to keep that in mind,
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當談到某些議題
05:59
because when you are talking
about a topic,
about a topic,
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06:01
and you're sharing your story,
and sharing what is important,
and sharing what is important,
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你分享你的故事，分享甚麼是重要的
維持自己的可信度
06:04
you stay authentic.
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維持資料，資訊的可信度
06:05
Stay authentic to the data,
to the information,
to the information,
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06:07
to the importance of this topic.
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在這議題的重要性上
06:09
If I was talking to an individual
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假設我和某個人談話時
06:11
and they said,
"Why are vaccines important?"
"Why are vaccines important?"
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他們問：「為什麼接種疫苗重要？」
我沒有其他答案
06:13
I would say nothing alongside
any other answer,
any other answer,
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06:15
I would not in any way fathomably
give them answer outside of:
give them answer outside of:
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也不會透過任何方式
給出以下回答外的答案：
給出以下回答外的答案：
06:19
people are dying, and that's important.
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因為人們會死去，這很重要
06:21
And that children are dying,
and that's important.
and that's important.
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孩子會死去，很重要
06:24
And that we're having disease outbreaks
that should not be here.
that should not be here.
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這也會引起本不該發生的疾病
我相信，就像約翰．博伊爾所說
06:27
And I believe, as John Boyle put it,
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這些疾病應該只出現在歷史課本上
而非繼續存在於我們之中
而非繼續存在於我們之中
06:29
these diseases should be in history books
and not in our communities.
and not in our communities.
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因為這樣，你必須下定決心捍衛真理
06:32
So because of that, you need to make
a personal decision to stand up for truth.
a personal decision to stand up for truth.
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06:36
You need to make
a personal decision for yourself
a personal decision for yourself
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為了自己下定決心
06:38
to say, "This is accurate,
this is what's real,
this is what's real,
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並說：「這是正確的，這是真的
06:41
and these lies are not OK."
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那些謊言是不好的。」
06:43
Because it started with me
doing that on a personal level.
doing that on a personal level.
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這件事是從我個人開始著手進行的
不是一天之內就從小鎮進展到參議院
06:45
I wasn't going from small town
to Senate in a day.
to Senate in a day.
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06:48
It wasn't like, I go to bed, I wake up
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不是說，睡了一覺，起床後
06:50
and there's Senator Isakson,
asking me questions about vaccines.
asking me questions about vaccines.
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艾薩克森參議員就在那邊
等著問我疫苗接種的相關問題
等著問我疫苗接種的相關問題
這是一個很漫長的過程
事情會開始是因為我說
事情會開始是因為我說
06:53
It was a slow progression
and it started with me saying,
and it started with me saying,
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「這是真的」
06:55
"This is true,
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「雖然我媽媽不相信，不過沒關係。」
06:57
my mom doesn't believe it, but that's OK."
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06:59
Because that doesn't change the truth,
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因為事實不會因此而不一樣
07:01
doesn't change what's accurate
and what's important.
and what's important.
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正確以及重要的部分也不會改變
07:03
And honestly, the biggest thing,
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說真的，最重要的問題是
07:06
this whole idea of unbreakable:
remain unbroken.
remain unbroken.
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這個堅不可摧的想法依舊無法被打破
07:09
When you stand up for what's true
and you have that criticism,
and you have that criticism,
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你為真理挺身而出時
同時也會有對你的批判
同時也會有對你的批判
07:12
and you're trying to cause
a movement, don't sway.
a movement, don't sway.
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當你試著做些甚麼時
千萬不要受到動搖
千萬不要受到動搖
07:15
Thank you.
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謝謝
07:16
(Applause)
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（掌聲）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Ethan Lindenberger - Science advocateEthan Lindenberger advocates for science.
Why you should listen
Ethan Lindenberger is an 18-year-old High school student at Norwalk High School in Norwalk Ohio. He is by all accounts a normal teenager: he serves at his local church, has a part-time job, works an internship and takes part in extracurricular activities. In early February of 2019, Lindenberger began to find media attention after pursuing vaccines against the approval of his mother. This became a national story and led him to testify to the Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions Committee about his experiences. Since then, Lindenberger has continued to take part in advocating for science. He believes that everyone has a role to play in ending misinformation, and he has spoken to the importance of scientific truth while maintaining respect for those that have fallen victim to misinformation.
Ethan Lindenberger | Speaker | TED.com