ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Gautam Bhan - Urbanist
Gautam Bhan studies how cities produce and reproduce poverty and inequality.

Why you should listen

Gautam Bhan's work is based in and emerges from particular cities that for a long time were thought to be "peripheral" -- Delhi, Mumbai, Cairo, Lagos, Jakarta and Johannesburg -- cities of what is sometimes today called the "global south." He feels passionate about producing knowledge not just about these cities but doing so from them. For too long, he says, "Southern cities have been places for others to come and fix, rather than places with their own ways of getting things done that work for us."

Bhan believes that urbanization in the global south is one of the most profound challenges of the 21st century. It's in these cities that many of the battles of sustainability and equity will either be won or lost. He found his way to these questions in his own city -- New Delhi -- through forced evictions, the brutal demolition of the homes of the city's poorest who lived in informal settlements that brought him to his work on housing and the right to the city. His research is informed by his own political engagement both as an anti-eviction activist as well as someone working with the government to prevent evictions from occurring in the first place. 

Bhan teaches as the Indian Institute for Human Settlements in Bangalore, a new educational institution that shares his intent of bringing together teaching, research and practice on the city as well as producing knowledge from the south. In 2017, he authored In the Public’s Interest: Evictions, Citizenship and Inequality in Contemporary Delhi (Orient Blackswan/University of Georgia Press), as well as co-edited the Routledge Companion to Planning in the Global South (Routledge). He writes as much publicly as academically and is a frequent columnist in Indian newspapers, blogs and online. He is also the co-founder of New Text, and he's deeply involved in sexuality rights movements in India.

More profile about the speaker
Gautam Bhan | Speaker | TED.com
TED Talks India

Gautam Bhan: A bold plan to house 100 million people

高塔姆布: 供應一億人住房的大膽計畫

Filmed:
529,047 views

孟買、德里、清奈、加爾各答,和印度各地的主要城市都有個共同點:很歡迎來找工作的人。但在這開放和包容的另一端是什麼?是一億人的住房短缺。很多人最後不得不住在非正式的定居處。高塔姆布是人類住居專家和研究者,他針對這問題思考解決方案,大膽提出住房計畫,分享印度都市的新遠景,在那裡的每個人都有安全、堅固的家。
- Urbanist
Gautam Bhan studies how cities produce and reproduce poverty and inequality. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

沙魯克罕:不論孟買或德里,
清奈或加爾各答,
00:12
Shah沙阿 Rukh魯克 Khan: Be it Mumbai孟買 or Delhi新德里,
Chennai or Kolkata加爾各答,
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00:14
all our big cities城市 have
one great thing in common共同,
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我們所有的大城市都有一個共同點,
00:17
they happily高高興興 welcome歡迎 people from
smaller places地方 arriving到達 in search搜索 of work.
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它們都快樂地歡迎
從小地方來找工作的人。
還有一點,就是這樣的
溫暖歡迎是會有後果的。
00:23
What is also true真正 is that
this warm welcome歡迎 leads引線 to consequences後果.
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00:29
Problems問題 like housing住房
in these cities城市 are born天生.
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在這些城市中,
住房的問題就產生了。
00:32
Today今天 we have with us a human人的 settlement沉降
expert專家 and researcher研究員: Dr博士. Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan,
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今天我們請到人類住居專家
和研究者,高塔姆布博士,
00:37
who is re-imagining重新想像 a solution
to this increasing增加 problem問題.
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針對這個日益嚴重的問題,
他正在重新思考解決方案。
00:41
He will share分享 with us the new picture圖片
of urban城市的 India印度 that he can see.
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他要和我們分享
他看見的印度都市寫照。
00:47
TEDTED Talks會談 India印度 New Thoughts思考
welcomes歡迎 Dr博士. Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan.
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TED Talks 印度場「新點子」
歡迎高塔姆布博士。
00:50
Dr博士. Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan, everyone大家.
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各位,高塔姆布博士。
00:51
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
01:03
Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan: In this country國家,
until直到 a few少數 years年份 ago,
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高塔姆布:在這個國家,
直到幾年前,
如果你問別人:
01:05
if you asked someone有人:
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01:07
"Where are you from?"
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「你來自哪裡?」
01:09
the answer回答 would be
Delhi新德里, Mumbai孟買, Kolkata加爾各答.
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答案可能會是德里、
孟買、加爾各答。
你馬上接著再問:
01:13
You'd immediately立即 ask again:
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01:16
"Where do you belong屬於?"
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「你屬於哪裡?」
01:19
Until直到 recently最近 in India印度,
nobody沒有人 was from a city;
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在印度,直到最近,
都沒有人是來自城市的;
01:24
people only migrated遷移 to the city.
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人們只是移居到城市。
這正在改變。
01:26
This is changing改變.
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01:28
Urbanization城市化 is changing改變 India印度,
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都市化正在改變印度,
01:32
but are our cities城市 prepared準備?
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但我們的城市準備好了嗎?
01:35
Let's assume承擔 you were born天生 somewhere某處 else其他.
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假設你在其他地方出生。
01:38
Your parents父母 worked工作 as laborers勞動者 all day.
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你的父母每天要做勞力工作。
01:43
Then you too would have come
to a city for progress進展.
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你也會進城去找發展。
01:46
Or maybe, like it happens發生 today今天,
you were born天生 in the city itself本身.
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或者就像現今的狀況,你生在城市裡。
01:49
One day you go out looking
for an accommodation住所 in the city,
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有天,你外出到城市裡尋求住處,
01:54
to buy購買 or maybe just to rent出租.
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去買房子或是只是去租房子。
01:57
Will you be able能夠 find an affordable實惠 home?
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你能夠找到你負擔得起的家嗎?
02:02
The government政府 says we are falling落下
short of at least最小 20 million百萬 homes家園.
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政府說,我們至少缺少了兩千萬個家。
02:07
20 million百萬 homes家園,
that's 100 million百萬 people.
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兩千萬個家,那就是一億人。
02:11
And this is not the shortage短缺 of 3 BHKsBHKs
(bedroom臥室 hall大廳 kitchen廚房).
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這並不是短少全套公寓
(臥房、客廳、廚房)。
短少的住房中,有 95%
02:14
95 percent百分 of the shortage短缺
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02:16
is for people earning盈利
10 to 15,000 rupees盧比 per month.
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是月收入 10,000~15,000
盧比的人需要的住房。
02:20
Will you be able能夠 to find
an affordable實惠 home in this budget預算?
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用這樣的預算,你能找到
負擔得起的住房嗎?
02:24
If this happened發生 with you,
what would you do?
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若發生在你身上,你會怎麼做?
02:27
Home is not a car汽車
or some sort分類 of jewellery珠寶.
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家並不是車子或是某種珠寶。
02:29
Home is food餐飲 and clothes衣服.
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家是食物和衣著。
02:31
Nobody沒有人 can live生活 without it.
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沒有家,沒有人可以生活。
02:34
If you couldn't不能 find a home
in a city to either buy購買 or rent出租,
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如果你在城市中無法買或租一個家,
你也會被迫和多數人一樣,
02:37
you too would be driven驅動 to do
what most people end結束 up doing.
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02:42
Make a home wherever哪裡 possible可能.
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在任何能夠棲身之處住下來。
02:46
You too would make a settlement沉降.
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你會住下來。
02:48
The government政府 may可能 keep calling調用 it a slum貧民窟,
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政府可能稱它為貧民窟,
02:51
but like the people living活的 there,
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但和那裡的居民一樣,
我也會稱它為定居處。
02:53
I too will call it a settlement沉降.
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02:56
One hundred million百萬 are not homeless無家可歸.
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一億人並不是無家可歸,
02:59
They have homes家園.
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他們有家,
03:01
Homes家園 they built內置 on their own擁有.
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他們自己建造的家。
03:03
But most of these homes家園
are in settlements定居點.
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但這些家大部份都在定居處。
03:07
This is the truth真相
of an affordable實惠 home in India印度.
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這是印度可負擔之家的真相。
03:11
The homes家園 in settlements定居點 are cheap低廉,
but not sturdy粗壯.
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定居處的家便宜,但不堅固。
03:15
The homes家園 outside are sturdy粗壯,
but not cheap低廉.
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外面的家則堅固,但不便宜。
03:19
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
03:22
We will have to lay鋪設 the foundation基礎
of a new thought from here itself本身.
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我們得為這裡產生的新想法奠定基礎。
03:26
A settlement沉降 is not a problem問題;
it is a solution.
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定居處並不是問題,解決方案才是。
03:31
We just have to make it secure安全 and sturdy粗壯.
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我們得把它做得更安全、更堅固。
03:34
To fulfill履行 the shortage短缺
of 20 million百萬 homes家園
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若要補足短少的兩億間住家,
03:37
you cannot不能 make 20 million百萬
25 square廣場 foot腳丫子 flats公寓,
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不可能建造兩億間
25 平方英尺的平房,
03:43
and neither也不 should you be making製造 them.
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也不應該這麼做。
03:45
For example take the Karnataka卡納塔克邦 government政府.
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以卡納塔克邦政府為例。
03:49
They have a very good record記錄 in this.
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他們在這方面有很好的記錄。
03:53
By 2020, Karnataka卡納塔克邦 needs需求
2.6 million百萬 homes家園.
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到 2020 年,卡納塔克邦
會需要 260 萬間住家。
03:58
In the last ten years年份 they have managed管理
to make 350,000 homes家園.
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在過去十年間,他們已經
想辦法產出了 35 萬間住家。
04:02
Even if a government政府 tries嘗試
with complete完成 sincerity誠意,
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即使政府用最大誠意來努力,
04:07
it cannot不能 fulfill履行 this need
in the next下一個 couple一對 of lifetimes壽命.
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也無法滿足接下來幾代的需求。
如果我們不建立新家,
04:10
If we do not make new homes家園,
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04:13
then what is the next下一個 solution?
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下一個解決方案是什麼?
04:15
How to make a settlement沉降 secure安全?
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如何讓定居處變安全?
04:17
Firstly首先, eviction趕出 needs需求 to be stopped停止.
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首先,驅逐必須要停止。
04:20
Bulldozing推土機 needs需求 to be stopped停止.
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鏟平必須要停止。
04:23
Never has that resulted導致
in progress進展 in the past過去,
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在過去,那些做法並沒有造成進步,
04:25
nor也不 will it in the future未來.
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在未來也不可能會。
04:26
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
04:31
We have to start開始 believing相信 that
the laborers勞動者 who build建立 and run the city
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我們得要開始相信,
建立並管理城市的勞工
擁有該城市之土地的權力。
04:36
have a right over the land土地 of that city.
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04:38
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
04:42
I know you are thinking思維
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我知道你們在想,
定居處建在非法占用的土地上。
04:44
that settlements定居點 are made製作
on illegally非法 captured捕獲 land土地,
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04:48
but capturing捕獲 of land土地 never happens發生
in the dead of the night.
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但占用土地並不是一夜發生的。
04:52
Whether是否 the land土地 belongs屬於
to the government政府 or not,
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不論土地是否屬於政府,
定居處都不可能是安全建成的。
04:55
a settlement沉降 is never formed形成 secretly偷偷.
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隨時間,它開始有人居住。
04:58
It is inhabited居住 over time.
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04:59
The government政府 also agrees同意 that
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政府也知道
05:01
the settlements定居點 in our cities城市 have been
there for over 10, 20, 30, even 40 years年份.
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我們城市中的定居處已經在那裡有
10、20、30,甚至 40 年之久了。
這算是什麼非法佔用的土地?
05:07
What kind of
illegally非法 captured捕獲 land土地 is this,
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05:09
which哪一個 was ignored忽視 for 30 years年份
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三十年來都沒人管,
卻在驅逐的前一天
突然宣佈是非法的?
05:12
and suddenly突然 a day before eviction趕出
is declared聲明 illegal非法?
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05:17
A settlement沉降 can easily容易 accommodate容納
15 to 60 percent百分 of a city's城市的 population人口
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定居處可輕易容納
城市中 15%~60% 的人口,
只要用那土地的
1%、2%,最多 10%。
05:22
by using運用 just one, two
or maximum最大值 ten percent百分 of the land土地.
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05:27
Can such這樣 a huge巨大 number of people not have
a right over this small bit of land土地?
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難道不能給予這麼多的人擁有
這麼小小一塊地的權力嗎?
05:31
A city's城市的 progress進展 is often經常 measured測量
by the cost成本 of its land土地.
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一個城市的進步,通常是
用其土地的成本來測量。
05:35
How do you ascribe歸咎於 a cost成本 to the life
of a person living活的 on a piece of land土地?
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居住在一小片土地上的
人命成本要如何計算?
05:38
A settlement沉降 is not asking you
for shiny閃亮 homes家園;
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定居處的居民並不要求華麗的住房;
05:42
all it's asking for is basic基本 necessities必需品:
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只請求最基本的需要:
05:45
electricity電力, roads道路, water,
toilets洗手間 and drainage引流.
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電力、道路、供水、廁所、下水道。
05:50
We call this upgradation升級.
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我們稱之為升級。
05:55
Here's這裡的 an example of upgradation升級.
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以下是個升級的例子。
在艾哈邁德阿巴德有一項專案,
05:57
In Ahmedabad艾哈邁達巴德, they started開始 a program程序
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05:59
where for ten years年份, 44 settlements定居點 were
promised許諾 there wouldn't不會 be any eviction趕出.
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保證針對 44 個定居處
在十年內都不會進行任何驅逐。
06:03
Only a promise諾言.
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只是一個保證,
06:05
Nothing written書面, no documents文件.
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沒有書面文件。
06:07
And basic基本 necessities必需品
were provided提供 to them.
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提供他們基本的必需品。
06:10
In ten years年份 that slum貧民窟 changed into
a locality局部性, a place地點, a world世界 of its own擁有.
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十年後,那貧民窟本身轉變成了
一個地區、一個地方、一個世界。
06:16
The government政府 didn't have to build建立
even a single new home.
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政府甚至不需要
建立任何一間新住所。
06:19
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
06:24
Thailand泰國 launched推出 this program程序
at national國民 scale規模,
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泰國在全國推行的專案
06:29
benefiting受益 100,000 people in 137 cities城市.
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讓 137 個城市的十萬人受惠。
06:33
And every一切 person was given特定 the right
to live生活 over that land土地.
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且每個人都得到
住在那塊土地上的權利。
06:38
But pay工資 attention注意 here.
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但,要注意。
06:39
Not the right to sell,
but the right to live生活 there,
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不是販售的權利,
而是居住在那裡的權利,
06:43
use it, settle解決 on it.
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可以使用這塊土地,在上面定居。
06:46
The whole整個 world世界 knows知道 now
that to move移動 forward前鋒,
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現在全世界都知道要向前走,
我們不能移除定居處。
06:51
we cannot不能 remove去掉 settlements定居點.
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06:53
We can only advance提前 when we think of ways方法
to make settlements定居點 secure安全 and sturdy粗壯.
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只有透過思考如何讓定居處
更安全、更堅固,才能讓我們進步。
06:59
But just one thing.
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但有個重點。
如果我們知道這些,為什麼沒實現?
07:00
If we know it, then why doesn't it happen發生?
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07:03
To apply應用 this new thinking思維 to settlements定居點,
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要把這個新想法應用到定居處上,
07:06
we, that is you and me,
need to look deep within
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我們,你和我,需要看得更深入,
拋棄我們原本的反感、
不尊重,以及擔心憂慮。
07:10
and get rid擺脫 of the disgust厭惡, disrespect
and apprehensions疑慮 that we have.
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07:18
Actually其實 I should not be standing常設
here in front面前 of you today今天.
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其實,今天站在這裡,
站在各位面前的人不應該是我。
07:22
A person from the settlement沉降 who lives生活
there should be standing常設 here.
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應該是一位住在定居處的人才對。
07:29
But if someone有人 like that came來了 here,
you wouldn't不會 have listened聽了 to him.
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但如果那樣的人來到這裡,
你們也不會聽他說。
07:34
You are listening to me, because you think
I am not from a settlement沉降.
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你們會傾聽我,是因為你們認為
我不是來自定居處的人。
07:38
This is the very thought
that needs需求 to be changed.
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正是這種想法需要被改變。
07:42
Thank you.
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謝謝。
07:42
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
07:51
SRKsrk: Thank you very much.
Thank you, Dr博士. Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan.
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沙魯克罕:非常謝謝你,
高塔姆布博士。
07:53
Thanks謝謝 a lot.
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十分感謝。
07:55
Please tell me, you just gave
an example of Thailand泰國
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請告訴我,你剛剛舉了泰國的例子,
07:58
and the big thing there is
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例子的重點是,
08:00
the homes家園 are for people
to settle解決 in, not to sell.
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那些住房是給人們定居用的,
不是銷售用的。
08:04
They cannot不能 be used for sale拍賣.
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它們不能被拿來買賣。
08:07
Is there a similar類似 thought process處理
or program程序 in our country國家 too,
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你的演說以及你身邊的人,
是否有在我們的國家裡
08:11
inspired啟發 by your talks會談
and those of people around you?
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鼓舞了類似的想法或計畫?
08:14
GBGB: I wouldn't不會 say by me,
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高塔姆布:我不會說是我鼓舞的,
08:16
but by the people movement運動
who are fighting戰鬥 for rights權利 in the city.
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而是由那些在城市中為了權利
而奮戰的人民運動所鼓舞的。
08:22
That is making製造 a difference區別.
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那會造成不同。
08:24
For instance, in Odisha奧里薩邦
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比如,在奧里薩邦,
08:25
the Chief首席 Minister部長, Mr先生. Patnaik帕奈克,
announced公佈 the same相同 scheme方案:
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首席部長帕特奈克
宣佈了同樣的方案:
08:30
that all the people in settlements定居點
will have rights權利 over that land土地.
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在定居地的所有人,
都有那塊土地的權利。
08:35
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
08:38
And I think this scheme方案
shouldn't不能 be called populism民粹主義;
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我認為這項方案不該
被稱為是民粹主義;
08:43
it should be called an economic經濟
development發展 strategy戰略.
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它應該被稱為是經濟發展策略。
08:45
Because economic經濟 development發展 does not
happen發生 from the top最佳, but from the bottom底部.
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因為經濟發展不是
從上位開始的,而是從基層。
(掌聲)
08:50
(Applause掌聲)
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08:54
SRKsrk: I too promise諾言
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沙魯克罕:我也保證,
08:56
I will only say settlements定居點,
and not slums貧民窟, ever again. 100 percent百分.
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我以後絕對只會說定居地,
不會說貧民窟這詞。
09:00
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
09:03
Dr博士. BhanBhan you came來了 here and said such這樣
wonderful精彩 things.
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博士,你來這裡說了
很多很棒的內容。
09:07
There is a song歌曲. I will not sing it,
as I am a terrible可怕 singer歌手.
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有一首歌,我不會唱出來,
因為我很不會唱歌。
高塔姆布:我也很不會唱歌。
09:10
GBGB: I too am a terrible可怕 singer歌手.
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09:12
SRKsrk: But we can't keep shut關閉 also,
because we are saying wonderful精彩 things.
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沙魯克罕:但我們也不能不作聲,
因為我們說了很棒的內容。
(笑聲)
09:15
(laughter笑聲)
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那就用說的吧。
09:16
So we will just say it.
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慢慢地,心會找到定居處。
09:17
Slowly慢慢地 the heart will find settlement沉降.
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高塔姆布:慢慢地,心會找到定居處。
09:20
GBGB: Slowly慢慢地 the heart will find settlement沉降.
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09:22
SRKsrk: Only then will life be filled填充
with love and fun開玩笑 times.
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沙魯罕:唯有到那時,
生命才會充滿愛和歡樂時光。
09:25
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
各位先生女士,
高塔姆布博士。謝謝。
09:26
Ladies女士們 and gentlemen紳士, Dr博士. Gautam佛陀 BhanBhan.
Thank you.
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(掌聲)
09:28
(Applause掌聲)
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09:29
Thank you very much.
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非常謝謝。
09:30
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
Translated by Lilian Chiu
Reviewed by Yanyan Hong

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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Gautam Bhan - Urbanist
Gautam Bhan studies how cities produce and reproduce poverty and inequality.

Why you should listen

Gautam Bhan's work is based in and emerges from particular cities that for a long time were thought to be "peripheral" -- Delhi, Mumbai, Cairo, Lagos, Jakarta and Johannesburg -- cities of what is sometimes today called the "global south." He feels passionate about producing knowledge not just about these cities but doing so from them. For too long, he says, "Southern cities have been places for others to come and fix, rather than places with their own ways of getting things done that work for us."

Bhan believes that urbanization in the global south is one of the most profound challenges of the 21st century. It's in these cities that many of the battles of sustainability and equity will either be won or lost. He found his way to these questions in his own city -- New Delhi -- through forced evictions, the brutal demolition of the homes of the city's poorest who lived in informal settlements that brought him to his work on housing and the right to the city. His research is informed by his own political engagement both as an anti-eviction activist as well as someone working with the government to prevent evictions from occurring in the first place. 

Bhan teaches as the Indian Institute for Human Settlements in Bangalore, a new educational institution that shares his intent of bringing together teaching, research and practice on the city as well as producing knowledge from the south. In 2017, he authored In the Public’s Interest: Evictions, Citizenship and Inequality in Contemporary Delhi (Orient Blackswan/University of Georgia Press), as well as co-edited the Routledge Companion to Planning in the Global South (Routledge). He writes as much publicly as academically and is a frequent columnist in Indian newspapers, blogs and online. He is also the co-founder of New Text, and he's deeply involved in sexuality rights movements in India.

More profile about the speaker
Gautam Bhan | Speaker | TED.com