TEDxOslo
Nina Dølvik Brochmann and Ellen Støkken Dahl: The virginity fraud
Nina Dolvik Brokman, Elen Stoken Dal (Nina Dølvik Brochmann, Ellen Støkken Dahl): Prevara vezana za nevinost
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Himen je i dalje najneshvaćeniji deo ženskog tela. Nina Dolvik Brokman i Elen Stoken Dal dele svoju misiju da osnaže mlade ljude kroz bolje seksualno obrazovanje, smanjujući ugled popularnih (i štetnih) mitova koje su nam ispričali o nevinosti i himenu.
Nina Dølvik Brochmann - Doctor, writer
Nina Dølvik Brochmann, M.D. wants to empower women through good sexual education. Full bioEllen Støkken Dahl - Medical student, writer
Ellen Støkken Dahl is spreading medical expertise and enthusiasm for sexual health as a teacher for teenagers, sex workers and refugees. Full bio
Nina Dølvik Brochmann, M.D. wants to empower women through good sexual education. Full bioEllen Støkken Dahl - Medical student, writer
Ellen Støkken Dahl is spreading medical expertise and enthusiasm for sexual health as a teacher for teenagers, sex workers and refugees. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
Nina Dølvik Brochmann:
We grew up believing
We grew up believing
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Nina Dolvik Brokman:
Odrasli smo verujući
Odrasli smo verujući
00:14
that the hymen is a proof of virginity.
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da je himen dokaz nevinosti.
00:19
But it turns out, we were wrong.
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Ali ispada da nismo bili u pravu.
00:22
What we discovered
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Ono što smo otkrili
00:23
is that the popular story we're told
about female virginity
about female virginity
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je to da popularna priča
koju su nam ispričali o nevinosti žene
koju su nam ispričali o nevinosti žene
00:28
is based on two anatomical myths.
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zasnovana na dva anatomska mita.
00:33
The truth has been known
in medical communities for over 100 years,
in medical communities for over 100 years,
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Istina je poznata u medicinskim
društvima preko 100 godima,
društvima preko 100 godima,
00:38
yet somehow these two myths
continue to make life difficult
continue to make life difficult
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a ova dva mita ipak nekako
nastavljaju da otežavaju život
nastavljaju da otežavaju život
00:44
for women around the world.
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ženama širom celog sveta.
00:47
Ellen Støkken Dahl:
The first myth is about blood.
The first myth is about blood.
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Elen Stoken Dal: Prvi mit je o krvi.
00:51
It tells us that the hymen
breaks and bleeds
breaks and bleeds
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On nam govori da himen puca i krvari
00:55
the first time a woman has vaginal sex.
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prvi put kada žena ima vaginalni seks.
00:59
In other words, if there is no blood
on the sheets afterwards,
on the sheets afterwards,
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Drugim rečima, ako nema krvi
na posteljini nakon čina,
na posteljini nakon čina,
01:02
then the woman was simply not a virgin.
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onda žena jednostavno nije bila devica.
01:06
The second myth is a logical
consequence of the first.
consequence of the first.
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Drugi mit je logičan nastavak drugog.
01:11
Since the hymen is thought
to break and bleed,
to break and bleed,
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Pošto se veruje da himen puca i krvari,
01:15
people also believe
that it actually disappears
that it actually disappears
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ljudi takođe veruju da isto tako i nestaje
01:19
or is in some way radically altered
during a woman's first intercourse.
during a woman's first intercourse.
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ili je na neki način radikalno promenjen
tokom ženinog prvog snošaja.
tokom ženinog prvog snošaja.
01:26
If that were true,
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Ako je to istina,
01:28
one would easily be able to determine
if a woman is a virgin or not
if a woman is a virgin or not
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osoba bi lako mogla odrediti
da li je žena nevina ili ne
da li je žena nevina ili ne
01:33
by examining her genitals,
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pomoću ispitivanja njenih genitalija,
01:36
by doing a virginity check.
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obavljanjem provere nevinosti.
01:40
NDB: So that's our two myths:
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NDB: Pa, to su naša dva mita:
01:42
virgins bleed,
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device krvare
01:43
and hymens are lost forever.
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i himeni su izgubljeni zauvek.
01:47
Now, this may sound
like a minor issue to you.
like a minor issue to you.
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Sada, ovo vam može zvučati
kao mali problem.
kao mali problem.
01:50
Why should you care
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Zašto bi vam bilo stalo
01:52
about an obscure little skin fold
on the female body?
on the female body?
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do nejasne, male, savitljive kože
na ženskom telu?
na ženskom telu?
01:57
But the truth is,
this is about so much more
this is about so much more
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Ali, istina je da se ovde radi
o nečemu više
o nečemu više
02:01
than an anatomical misunderstanding.
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od običnog anatomskog nesporazuma.
02:05
The myths about the hymen
have lived on for centuries
have lived on for centuries
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Mitovi o himenu postoje vekovima
02:09
because they have cultural significance.
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zbog njegovog kulturološkog značaja.
02:12
They have been used as a powerful tool
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Korišćeni su kao moćno sredstvo
02:15
in the effort to control women's sexuality
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u pokušaju kontrolisanja
ženske seksualnosti
ženske seksualnosti
02:18
in about every culture,
religion and historical decade.
religion and historical decade.
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u skoro svakoj kulturi,
religiji i istorijskoj deceniji.
religiji i istorijskoj deceniji.
02:24
Women are still mistrusted,
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Žene su i dalje pogrešno shvaćene,
02:28
shamed,
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posramljene,
02:29
harmed
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povređene
02:30
and, in the worst cases,
subjected to honor killings
subjected to honor killings
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i, u najgorim slučajevima,
podvrgnute ubistvima zbog časti
podvrgnute ubistvima zbog časti
02:34
if they don't bleed
on their wedding night.
on their wedding night.
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ako nisu krvarile tokom bračne noći.
02:38
Other women are forced
through degrading virginity checks,
through degrading virginity checks,
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Druge žene su primorane da prolaze
kroz ponižavajuće provere nevinosti
kroz ponižavajuće provere nevinosti
02:43
simply to obtain a job,
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jednostavno da bi dobile posao,
02:46
to save their reputation
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da bi sačuvale svoj ugled
02:48
or to get married.
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ili da bi se udale.
02:51
ESD: Like in Indonesia,
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ESD: Kao u Indoneziji,
02:53
where women are systematically examined
to enter military service.
to enter military service.
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gde se žene sistematski ispituju
da bi pristupile vojsci.
da bi pristupile vojsci.
02:59
After the Egyptian uprisings in 2011,
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Nakon ustanka u Egiptu 2011. godine,
03:02
a group of female protesters were forced
to undergo virginity checks
to undergo virginity checks
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grupu ženskih demonstranata je vojska
primorala da prođe kroz proveru nevinosti.
primorala da prođe kroz proveru nevinosti.
03:08
by their military.
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03:10
In Oslo, doctors are examining
the hymens of young girls
the hymens of young girls
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U Oslu doktori ispituju
himene mladih devojaka
himene mladih devojaka
03:15
to reassure parents
that their children are not ruined.
that their children are not ruined.
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da bi uverili roditelje
da njihova deca nisu upropašćena.
da njihova deca nisu upropašćena.
03:20
And sadly, the list goes on.
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I tužno je što se lista nastavlja.
03:24
Women are so afraid not to live up to
the myths about the hymen
the myths about the hymen
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Žene su u takvom strahu da ne ispune
očekivanja mitova o himenu
očekivanja mitova o himenu
03:29
that they choose to use
different virginity quick fixes
different virginity quick fixes
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da biraju da koriste
različite brze popravke nevinosti
različite brze popravke nevinosti
03:34
to assure a bleeding.
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da bi osigurale da se krvarenje javi.
03:36
That could be plastic surgery,
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To može biti plastična hirurgija,
03:38
known as "revirgination,"
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poznata kao „ponovna nevinost“,
03:40
it could be vials of blood
poured on the sheets after sex
poured on the sheets after sex
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to mogu biti epruvete krvi
prosute po posteljini nakon seksa
prosute po posteljini nakon seksa
03:44
or fake hymens bought online,
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ili lažni himeni kupljeni na internetu,
03:48
complete with theater blood
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ispunjeni pozorišnom krvlju
03:50
and a promise to "kiss your deep,
dark secret goodbye."
dark secret goodbye."
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i obećanjem da „kažu zbogom
svojim dubokim i mračnim tajnama“.
svojim dubokim i mračnim tajnama“.
03:58
NDB: By telling girls
that no deed can be kept secret,
that no deed can be kept secret,
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NDB: Govoreći devojkama
da nijedno delo ne može ostati tajna,
da nijedno delo ne može ostati tajna,
04:03
that their bodies
will reveal them no matter what,
will reveal them no matter what,
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da će ih njihova tela otkriti kad-tad,
04:07
we have endowed them with fear.
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podarili smo im strah.
04:12
Girls are afraid of ruining themselves,
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Devojke se plaše da će se upropastiti,
04:14
either through sport,
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bilo kroz sport,
04:16
play,
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igru,
04:17
tampon use
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korišćene tampona
04:19
or a sexual activity.
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ili seksualnu aktivnost.
04:21
We have curtailed their opportunities
and their freedoms.
and their freedoms.
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Smanjili smo njihove mogućnosti
i njihovu slobodu.
i njihovu slobodu.
04:26
It's time we put an end
to the virginity fraud.
to the virginity fraud.
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Vreme je da stanemo na kraj
prevari vezanoj za nevinost.
prevari vezanoj za nevinost.
04:30
It's time we break the myths
about the hymen
about the hymen
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Vreme je da razbijemo mitove o himenu
04:33
once and for all.
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jednom zauvek.
04:36
ESD: We are medical students,
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ESD: Mi smo studenti medicine,
04:38
sexual health workers
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seksualni zdravstveni radnici
04:40
and the authors
of "The Wonder Down Under."
of "The Wonder Down Under."
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i autorke „Čuda ispod“.
04:43
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
04:45
That's a popular science book
about the female genitals.
about the female genitals.
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To je popularna naučna knjiga
o ženskim genitalijama.
o ženskim genitalijama.
04:49
And in our experience,
people seem to believe
people seem to believe
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I prema našem iskustvu,
ljudi izgleda veruju
ljudi izgleda veruju
04:52
that the hymen is some kind of a seal
covering the vaginal opening.
covering the vaginal opening.
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da je himen neka vrsta pečata
koja pokriva vaginalni otvor.
koja pokriva vaginalni otvor.
04:58
In Norwegian, it is even called
"the virgin membrane."
"the virgin membrane."
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Na norveškom se čak i naziva
„devičanska membrana“.
„devičanska membrana“.
05:02
And with this,
we picture something fragile,
we picture something fragile,
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A to zamišljamo kao nešto krhko,
05:05
something easily destructible,
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nešto lako uništivo,
05:08
something you can rip through,
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nešto što možeš pocepati,
05:10
perhaps like a sheet of plastic wrapping.
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možda kao list plastičnog omota.
05:15
You may have wondered
why we brought a hula hoop onstage today.
why we brought a hula hoop onstage today.
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Možda ste se pitali zašto smo doneli
hula hop danas na scenu.
hula hop danas na scenu.
05:19
We'll show you.
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Pokazaćemo vam.
05:23
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
05:27
Now, it is very hard to hide
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Veoma je teško sakriti
05:29
that something has happened
to this hoop, right?
to this hoop, right?
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da se nešto dogodilo ovom obruču, zar ne?
05:33
It is different
before and after I punched it.
before and after I punched it.
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Drugačiji je pre nego što sam ga
udarila i nakon toga.
udarila i nakon toga.
05:37
The seal is broken,
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Pečat je slomljen,
05:39
and unless we change the plastic,
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i ukoliko ne promenimo plastiku,
05:41
it won't get back to its intact state.
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neće se vratiti u svoje prvobitno stanje.
05:44
So if we wanted to do a virginity check
on this hoop right here,
on this hoop right here,
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Stoga, ako bismo želeli da uradimo
proveru nevinosti na ovom obruču ovde,
proveru nevinosti na ovom obruču ovde,
05:48
right now,
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upravo sad,
05:50
that would be very easy.
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to bi bilo veoma lako.
05:52
It's easy to say that this hoop
is not a virgin anymore.
is not a virgin anymore.
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Lako je reći da ovaj obruč
nije više nevin.
nije više nevin.
05:59
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
06:01
NDB: But the hymen
is nothing like a piece of plastic
is nothing like a piece of plastic
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NDB: Ali himen nije uopšte nalik
na ovo parče plastike
na ovo parče plastike
06:04
you can wrap around your food,
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koje možeš omotati oko svoje hrane
06:06
or a seal.
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ili na pečat.
06:08
In fact ...
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U stvari...
06:12
it's more like this --
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više je nalik ovome -
06:14
a scrunchie or a rubber band.
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gumici za kosu ili lastišu.
06:18
The hymen is a rim of tissue
at the outer opening of the vagina.
at the outer opening of the vagina.
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Himen predstavlja obod tkiva
na spoljašnjem otvoru vagine.
na spoljašnjem otvoru vagine.
06:24
And usually, it has a doughnut
or a half-moon shape
or a half-moon shape
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I obično ima oblik krofne ili polumeseca
06:28
with a large, central hole.
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sa velikom rupom u sredini.
06:31
But this varies a lot,
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Ali ovo puno varira,
06:33
and sometimes hymens can have fringes,
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i ponekad himeni mogu imati rubove,
06:36
it can have several holes,
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mogu imati nekoliko rupa
06:39
or it can consist of lobes.
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i mogu se sastojati od nekoliko režnjeva.
06:42
In other words, hymens
naturally vary a lot in looks,
naturally vary a lot in looks,
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Drugim rečima, himeni se
prirodno veoma razlikuju po izgledu
prirodno veoma razlikuju po izgledu
06:47
and that is what makes it so hard
to do a virginity check.
to do a virginity check.
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i zbog toga je teško obaviti
proveru nevinosti.
proveru nevinosti.
06:53
ESD: Now that we know a bit more
about the hymen's anatomy,
about the hymen's anatomy,
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ESD: Sada kada znamo nešto više
o anatomiji himena,
o anatomiji himena,
06:57
it's time to get back to our two myths:
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vreme je da se vratimo na naša dva mita:
07:00
virgins bleed,
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device krvare,
07:01
hymens are lost forever.
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himeni su izgubljeni zauvek.
07:05
But the hymen doesn't
have to break at all.
have to break at all.
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Ali himen uopšte ne mora da pukne.
07:09
The hymen is like a scrunchie
in function as well as in looks.
in function as well as in looks.
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Himen je kao gumica za kosu
po funkciji i izgledom.
po funkciji i izgledom.
07:15
And you can stretch a scrunchie, right?
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A gumica može da se razvuče, zar ne?
07:18
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
07:20
You can stretch a hymen, too.
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I himen se može razvući.
07:23
In fact, it's very elastic.
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U stvari, veoma je elastičan.
07:28
And for a lot of women,
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I kod mnogo žena
07:29
the hymen will be elastic enough
to handle a vaginal intercourse
to handle a vaginal intercourse
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himen će biti dovoljno elastičan
da podnese vaginalni snošaj,
da podnese vaginalni snošaj,
07:34
without sustaining any damage.
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a da ne pretrpi neku štetu.
07:39
For other women, the hymen may tear a bit
to make room for the penis,
to make room for the penis,
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Drugim ženama, himen se može pokidati malo
da bi napravio mesto za penis,
da bi napravio mesto za penis,
07:44
but that won't make it disappear.
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ali neće zbog toga nestati,
07:47
But it may look
a bit different from before.
a bit different from before.
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ali će možda izgledati drugačije nego pre.
07:50
It naturally follows
that you can't examine the hymen
that you can't examine the hymen
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Prirodno sledi da se himen
ne može ispitati
ne može ispitati
07:53
to check for virginity status.
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da bi se ispitao status nevinosti.
07:56
This was noted over 100 years ago in 1906
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Ovo je primetila
pre 100 godina, 1906. godine,
pre 100 godina, 1906. godine,
08:00
by the Norwegian doctor Marie Jeancet.
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norveška doktorka Meri Ženset.
08:04
She examined a middle-aged sex worker
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Ona je ispitala seksualnu radnicu
srednjih godina
srednjih godina
08:09
and concluded that her genitalia
were reminiscent of a teenage virgin.
were reminiscent of a teenage virgin.
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i zaključila da su njene genitalije
bile nalik onima kod devica-tinejdžerki.
bile nalik onima kod devica-tinejdžerki.
08:15
But that makes sense, right?
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Ali to ima misla, zar ne?
08:17
Because if her hymen
was never damaged during sex,
was never damaged during sex,
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Jer ako njihov himen
nije nikad oštećen tokom seksa,
nije nikad oštećen tokom seksa,
08:21
then what were we expecting to see?
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šta smo onda očekivali da vidimo?
08:26
ESD: Since hymens come
in every shape and form,
in every shape and form,
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ESD: Pošto se himeni javljaju
u svim oblicima i formama,
u svim oblicima i formama,
08:30
it is difficult to know
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teško je znati
08:31
if a dent or a fold in it is there
because of previous damage
because of previous damage
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da li je neko udubljenje ili nabor ovde
zbog prethodno nanete štete
zbog prethodno nanete štete
08:36
or if it's just a normal
anatomical variant.
anatomical variant.
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ili je to samo normalna
anatomska varijacija.
anatomska varijacija.
08:41
The absurdity of virgin testing
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Apsurdnost testiranja nevinosti
08:44
is illustrated in a study
done on 36 pregnant teenagers.
done on 36 pregnant teenagers.
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je ilustrovana u istraživanju
urađenom na 36 trudnih tinejdžerki.
urađenom na 36 trudnih tinejdžerki.
08:51
When doctors examined their hymens,
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Kada su doktori ispitali njihove himene,
08:54
they could only find
clear signs of penetration
clear signs of penetration
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samo su pronašli jasne znakove penetracije
08:57
in two out of the 36 girls.
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kod 2 od 36 devojaka.
09:03
So unless you believe
in 34 cases of virgin births --
in 34 cases of virgin births --
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Stoga, osim u slučaju da verujete
u 34 porođaja devica -
u 34 porođaja devica -
09:08
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
09:10
we must all agree
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moramo se svi složiti
09:11
that also our second myth
has taken a vital blow.
has taken a vital blow.
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da je i drugi mit dobio značajan udarac.
09:17
You simply cannot look a woman
between her legs
between her legs
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Ne možete jednostavno ženu
samo pogledati između nogu
samo pogledati između nogu
09:20
and read her sexual story.
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i pročitati njenu seksualnu priču.
09:27
NDB: Like most myths,
the myths about the hymen are untrue.
the myths about the hymen are untrue.
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NDB: Kao i većina mitova,
oni o himenu su netačni.
oni o himenu su netačni.
09:33
There is no virgin seal
that magically disappears after sex,
that magically disappears after sex,
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Nema nikakvog devičanskog pečata
koji magično nestaje nakon seksa,
koji magično nestaje nakon seksa,
09:38
and half of virgins
can easily have sex without bleeding.
can easily have sex without bleeding.
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a polovina devica
može imati seks a da ne krvari.
može imati seks a da ne krvari.
09:45
We wish we could say
that by removing these myths,
that by removing these myths,
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Volele bismo da možemo reći
da će uz uklanjanje ovih mitova
da će uz uklanjanje ovih mitova
09:48
everything would be OK,
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sve biti okej,
09:51
that shame, harm and honor killings
would all just disappear.
would all just disappear.
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da će sram, šteta
i ubistva zbog časti nestati tek tako.
i ubistva zbog časti nestati tek tako.
09:57
But of course, it's not that simple.
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Ali, naravno, to nije toliko jednostavno.
10:00
Sexual oppression of women
comes from something much deeper
comes from something much deeper
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Seksualno ugnjetavanje žena
potiče iz nečeg mnogo dubljeg
potiče iz nečeg mnogo dubljeg
10:04
than a simple anatomical misunderstanding
about the properties of the hymen.
about the properties of the hymen.
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od jednostavnog anatomskog nesporazuma
o karakteristikama himena.
o karakteristikama himena.
10:11
It's a question of cultural and religious
control of women's sexuality.
control of women's sexuality.
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Pitanje je kulturološke i religijske
kontrole ženske seksualnosti.
kontrole ženske seksualnosti.
10:16
And that is much harder to change.
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A to je mnogo teže promeniti.
10:20
But we must try.
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Ali moramo pokušati.
10:23
ESD: As medical professionals,
this is our contribution.
this is our contribution.
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ESD: Ovo je naš doprinos
kao medicinskih profesionalaca.
kao medicinskih profesionalaca.
10:29
We want every girl, parent
and [future] husband to know
and [future] husband to know
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Želimo da svaka devojka,
roditelj i budući muž znaju
roditelj i budući muž znaju
10:33
what the hymen is and how it works.
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šta je himen i kako funkcioniše.
10:38
We want them to know
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Želimo da znaju
10:39
that the hymen can't be used
as a proof of virginity.
as a proof of virginity.
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da se himen ne može iskoristiti
kao dokaz nevinosti.
kao dokaz nevinosti.
10:44
And that way, we can remove
one of the most powerful tools
one of the most powerful tools
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I na taj način možemo ukloniti
jedno od najmoćnijih sredstava
jedno od najmoćnijih sredstava
10:48
used to control young women today.
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koje se koristi da se kontrolišu
mlade žene danas.
mlade žene danas.
10:53
After telling you this,
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Nakon što vam ovo kažemo,
10:56
you may wonder what the alternative is,
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možda ćete se zapitati šta je alternativa,
11:00
for if we cannot use the hymen
as a proof of virginity for women,
as a proof of virginity for women,
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jer ako ne možemo koristiti himen
kao dokaz nevinosti žena,
kao dokaz nevinosti žena,
11:05
then what should we use?
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šta onda treba da koristimo?
11:09
We opt for using nothing.
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Biramo da ne koristimo ništa.
11:12
(Cheering)
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(Ovacije)
11:14
If you --
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Ako vi -
11:16
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
11:22
If you really want to know
if a woman is a virgin or not,
if a woman is a virgin or not,
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Ako zaista želite da znate
da li je žena devica,
da li je žena devica,
11:26
ask her.
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pitajte je.
11:27
(Laughter)
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(Smeh)
11:29
But how she answers
that question is her choice.
that question is her choice.
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Ali kako će vam odgovoriti
na to pitanje je njen izbor.
na to pitanje je njen izbor.
11:35
Thank you.
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Hvala vam.
11:36
(Applause)
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(Aplauz)
ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Nina Dølvik Brochmann - Doctor, writerNina Dølvik Brochmann, M.D. wants to empower women through good sexual education.
Why you should listen
Nina Dølvik Brochmann, M.D. is spreading medical expertise and enthusiasm for sexual health as a teacher for teenagers, sex workers and refugees. With her collaborator Ellen Støkken Dahl, she has built up one of Norway’s most popular health blogs, Underlivet (The Life Below/The Genitals). After being frustrated by the amount of medical misconceptions and shame that surrounded the female body, she and Dahl wrote the popular science book, The Wonder Down Under: The Insider's Guide to the Anatomy, Biology, and Reality of the Vagina. This humorous and non-judgmental medical guidebook to the female genitalia has taken the world by storm and is currently being translated into more than 30 languages. She has a B.A. in political science from Columbia University (CC '10), and she currently works as doctor and writer based in Oslo, Norway.
Nina Dølvik Brochmann | Speaker | TED.com
Ellen Støkken Dahl - Medical student, writer
Ellen Støkken Dahl is spreading medical expertise and enthusiasm for sexual health as a teacher for teenagers, sex workers and refugees.
Why you should listen
Ellen Støkken Dahl wishes to empower women through good sexual education. With her collaborator Nina Dølvik Brochmann, she has built up one of Norway’s most popular health blogs, Underlivet (The Life Below/The Genitals). After being frustrated by the amount of medical misconceptions and shame that surrounded the female body, she and Brochmann wrote the popular science book, The Wonder Down Under: The Insider's Guide to the Anatomy, Biology, and Reality of the Vagina. This humorous and non-judgmental medical guidebook to the female genitalia has taken the world by storm and is currently being translated into more than 30 languages. She currently works as doctor and writer based in Oslo, Norway.
Ellen Støkken Dahl | Speaker | TED.com