ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Fadi Chehadé - Technologist, entrepreneur
Fadi Chehadé is focused on finding ways for society to benefit from technology and strengthening international cooperation in the digital space.

Why you should listen

Fadi Chehadé is a serial entrepreneur who has founded and led several companies in the digital space including Vocado LLC (acquired by Oracle in 2018) and Viacore (purchased by IBM in 2006). He is an advisory board member with the World Economic Forum's Center for the Fourth Industrial Revolution that focuses on maximizing the benefits of science and technology for society. Chehadé is also a member of the UN Secretary-General’s High-Level Panel on Digital Cooperation that will advance proposals to strengthen international cooperation in the digital space.  

Chehadé serves on the corporate boards of Sentry Data Systems and Interactions LLC and the advisory board of the University of Southern California’s Center on Public Diplomacy. For two years, he was a Senior Advisor to Prof. Klaus Schwab, Executive Chairman of the World Economic Forum, where he focused on public-private cooperation to address issues affecting the digital economy. As former President and CEO of ICANN, the global authority managing the Internet's logical infrastructure and ensuring "one" internet for the world, Chehadé guided its historic transition to an independent transnational institution governed jointly by private, public and civic stakeholders.

More profile about the speaker
Fadi Chehadé | Speaker | TED.com
Bryn Freedman - Editorial director and curator, TED Institute
Bryn Freedman helps those who want to give the "talk of their lives" in a clear, passionate and authentic way.

Why you should listen

Award-winning TV producer, investigative journalist and author, Bryn Freedman joined TED in 2014 as the editorial director and curator for the TED Institute. In her work with TED, Freedman creates and executes TED conference events for Fortune 500 companies, overseeing all editorial content as well as managing speaker coaches and determining both the topics for each talk and the overall conference theme. In addition to curating these events, she works as an executive speaker coach for professionals who want to give the "talk of their lives" in a clear, passionate and authentic way.

Freedman is also co-founder of Voices4Freedom, an international organization aimed at eradicating slavery through education and media.

More profile about the speaker
Bryn Freedman | Speaker | TED.com
TED Salon Verizon

Fadi Chehadé and Bryn Freedman: What everyday citizens can do to claim power on the internet

法迪 · 切哈德 與 布林 · 弗里德曼: 一般公民能做什麼來在網際網路上獲得權力?

Filmed:
1,526,164 views

科技建築師法迪 · 切哈德協助建立了讓網際網路能運作的基礎架構——域名系統和 IP 地址標準等必不可少的東西。現今,他將注意力集中在找到讓社會從科技中受益的方法。他和 TED 策展人布林 · 弗里德曼進行了一場乾脆利落的對談,討論了在人工智慧領域中,西方和中國之間正在進行中的戰爭,也討論了科技公司如何能成為管家,用它們擁有的力量來塑造人們的生活和經濟,以及如果要在網際網路上獲得權力,一般公民能做什麼。
- Technologist, entrepreneur
Fadi Chehadé is focused on finding ways for society to benefit from technology and strengthening international cooperation in the digital space. Full bio - Editorial director and curator, TED Institute
Bryn Freedman helps those who want to give the "talk of their lives" in a clear, passionate and authentic way. Full bio

Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.

00:12
Bryn布林 Freedman弗里德曼: So you said
that in the 20th century世紀,
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布林 · 弗里德曼:
你說過,在二十世紀,
00:15
global全球 power功率 was in the hands
of government政府.
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全球的權力掌握在政府的手中。
00:18
At the beginning開始 of this digital數字 century世紀,
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在這個數位世紀的初期,
00:21
it really moved移動 to corporations公司
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權力實際上移向了企業,
00:23
and that in the future未來,
it would move移動 to individuals個人.
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而在未來,權力將會移向個人。
00:26
And I've interviewed採訪 a lot of people,
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我訪談過很多人,
00:28
and they say you're wrong錯誤,
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他們都說你錯了,
00:30
and they are betting博彩 on the companies公司.
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他們都把權力押在公司手上。
00:32
So why are you right,
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所以,為什麼你是對的?
00:34
and why are individuals個人 going to win贏得 out?
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為什麼個人將會勝出?
00:37
Fadi法迪 Chehad切哈德é: Because companies公司
cater迎合 to individuals個人,
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法迪 · 切哈德:
因為公司會迎合個人,
00:39
and we as the citizenry公民
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而我們身為公民,
00:42
need to start開始 understanding理解
that we have a big role角色
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需要開始了解:要決定這個
世界會如何被管理、如何發展,
我們扮演著重要的角色。
00:46
in shaping成型 how the world世界
will be governed治理, moving移動 forward前鋒.
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00:49
Yes, indeed確實, the tug拖船 of war戰爭 right now
is between之間 governments政府,
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是的,的確,目前的角力
發生在各國政府之間,
00:53
who lost丟失 much of their power功率 to companies公司
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政府有大量的權力被公司奪走,
00:57
because the internet互聯網 is not built內置
around the nation-state民族國家 system系統
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是因為網際網路並不是以
民族國家為中心來建立的,
01:01
around which哪一個 governments政府 have power功率.
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而政府的權力卻是。
01:03
The internet互聯網 is transnational跨國.
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網路是跨國的。
01:05
It's not international國際,
and it's not national國民,
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它不是國際的,也不是國家的,
01:08
and therefore因此 the companies公司
became成為 very powerful強大.
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因此,公司變得非常強大。
01:12
They shape形狀 our economy經濟.
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它們塑造了我們的經濟。
01:13
They shape形狀 our society社會.
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它們塑造了我們的社會。
政府不知道該怎麼做。
現在,它們正作出反應。
01:15
Governments政府 don't know what to do.
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01:17
Right now, they're reacting反應.
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01:19
And I fear恐懼 that if we do not,
as the citizenry公民 --
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而我擔心,我們身為公民——
01:22
which哪一個 are, in my opinion意見,
the most important重要 leg of that stool糞便 --
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依我的看法,
這是凳子最重要的一隻腳——
01:27
don't take our role角色,
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卻不扮演我們的角色,
那麼,你就是對的。
01:29
then you are right.
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01:30
The detractors批評者, or the people telling告訴 you
that businesses企業 will prevail戰勝, are right.
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那些抨擊者,或者那些
告訴你企業會勝出的人,
他們是對的,企業的確會勝出。
01:35
It will happen發生.
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01:36
BFBF: So are you saying that individuals個人
will force businesses企業
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布:所以,你的意思是,
個人會迫使企業,
01:40
or business商業 will be forced被迫
to be responsive響應,
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也就是企業會被迫回應,
01:42
or is there a fear恐懼 that they won't慣於 be?
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或者擔憂「事實並非會如此發展」?
01:46
FCFC: I think they will be.
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法:我認為企業會回應。
01:47
Look at two weeks ago,
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看看兩週前
有一間叫做 Skip 的小公司,
01:49
a small company公司 called Skip跳躍
winning勝利 over Uber尤伯杯 and LyftLyft and everyone大家
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打敗了 Uber 和 Lyft 以及所有人,
01:53
to actually其實 get the license執照
for the San Francisco弗朗西斯科 scooter摩托車 business商業.
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取得了舊金山摩托車事業的執照。
01:59
And if you read why did Skip跳躍 win贏得,
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如果你細讀 Skip 為何會贏,
02:01
because Skip跳躍 listened聽了
to the people of San Francisco弗朗西斯科,
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那是因為 Skip 傾聽舊金山市民的意見:
02:04
who were tired of scooters滑板車
being存在 thrown拋出 everywhere到處,
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他們厭倦了摩托車被到處亂丟。
02:07
and actually其實 went to the city and said,
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實際上 Skip 跑到城市裡,並宣佈:
02:09
"We will deploy部署 the service服務,
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「我們會將這服務部署出去,
02:12
but we will respond響應
to the people's人們 requirements要求
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但我們會回應人民的需求,
02:15
that we organize組織 ourselves我們自己
around a set of rules規則."
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我們會根據一系列規定
來管理好自身。
02:18
They self-governed自治 their behavior行為,
and they won韓元 the contract合同
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他們自我行為管理,
擊敗了一些很龐大的公司,
贏得了合約。
02:21
over some very powerful強大 companies公司.
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02:23
BFBF: So speaking請講 of guidelines方針
and self-governance自治,
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布:既然談到準則和自我管理,
02:27
you've spent花費 an entire整個 lifetime一生
creating創建 guidelines方針 and norms規範
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你花了一輩子的時間
為網際網路制訂準則和標準。
02:31
for the internet互聯網.
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02:33
Do you think those days are over?
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你認為那些日子已經過去了嗎?
誰會來領導?
02:34
Who is going to guide指南,
who is going to control控制,
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誰會來控制?
誰會來制訂那些標準?
02:37
and who is going to create創建 those norms規範?
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02:39
FCFC: The rules規則 that govern治理
the technology技術 layers of the internet互聯網
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法:用來管理網際網路
技術層面的那些規定
02:45
are now well put in place地點,
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都已經很完善了,
02:47
and I was very busy for a few少數 years年份
setting設置 those rules規則
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有幾年我非常忙碌,
一直在建立一些規定
02:51
around the part部分 of the internet互聯網
that makes品牌 the internet互聯網 one network網絡.
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讓網際網路能夠統一。
02:55
The domain-name功能變數名稱 system系統, the IPIP numbers數字,
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域名系統、IP 地址表白呀,
02:58
all of that is in place地點.
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這些通通都就緒了。
02:59
However然而, as we get now
into the upper layers of the internet互聯網,
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然而,隨著我們現在進入了
網際網路更加抽象的層級,
03:04
the issues問題 that affect影響
me and you every一切 day --
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每天會影響我們的那些議題——
03:06
privacy隱私, security安全, etc等等. --
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隱私、安全性等——
03:09
the system系統 to create創建 norms規範 for those
unfortunately不幸 is not in place地點.
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不幸的是,為這些議題
建立標準的系統還沒有就緒。
03:17
So we do have an issue問題.
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所以,我們確實有問題。
03:18
We have a system系統
of cooperation合作 and governance治理
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現在我們真的非常需要
創造一個合作和管理的系統,
03:22
that really needs需求 to be created創建 right now
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03:25
so that companies公司, governments政府
and the citizenry公民 can agree同意
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讓公司、政府和公民
能對於這個數位新世界的
發展方向有所共識。
03:30
how this new digital數字 world世界
is going to advance提前.
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03:32
BFBF: So what gives
a digital數字 company公司 any incentive激勵?
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布:所以,是什麽
讓數位公司有了動機?
03:35
Let's say -- FacebookFacebook的 comes to mind心神 --
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比如說——我想到臉書——
03:37
they would say they have
their users'用戶' best最好 interests利益 at heart,
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他們會說他們心中都想著
用戶的最佳利益,
03:40
but I think a lot of people
would disagree不同意 with that.
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但我想很多人都不會同意這個說法。
03:43
FCFC: It's been very difficult to watch
how tech高科技 companies公司 have reacted反應
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法:看著科技公司如何對於
「公民對其科技的反應」
而作出反應,是蠻困難的。
03:49
to the citizenry's公民之家 response響應
to their technologies技術.
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03:52
And some of them, two or three years年份 ago,
basically基本上 dismissed駁回 it.
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兩、三年前,有些科技公司
基本上還不理會這些呢。
03:56
The word that I heard聽說 in many許多 board rooms客房
is, "We're just a technology技術 platform平台.
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我在許多會議室中聽到的說法是:
「我們只是一個科技平台。
04:01
It's not my issue問題
if my technology技術 platform平台
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那不關我的事,如果我的科技平台
04:04
causes原因 families家庭
to go kill their girls女孩 in Pakistan巴基斯坦.
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造成巴基斯坦的家庭殺害他們的女兒。
04:07
It's not my issue問題. It's their problem問題.
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那不關我的事。那是他們的問題。
04:09
I just have a technology技術 platform平台."
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我只是擁有一個科技平台而已。」
04:11
Now, I think we are now entering進入 a stage階段
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我想我們現在進入了一個階段,
04:15
where companies公司 are starting開始 to realize實現
this is no longer sustainable可持續發展,
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在這個階段,公司開始了解
這樣做並不永續,
04:20
and they're starting開始 to see the pushback推回
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他們開始看見負面的反應,
04:22
that's coming未來
from people, users用戶, citizens公民,
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這些來自人們、用戶、公民,
04:25
but also governments政府
that are starting開始 to say,
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但也來自政府。
他們開始說:「不能這樣。」
04:28
"This cannot不能 be."
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04:30
So I think there is a maturity到期
that is starting開始 to set,
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所以,我認為成熟期開始出現了,
04:35
especially特別 in that Silicon Valley area,
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特別是在矽谷地區,
04:38
where people are beginning開始 to say,
"We have a role角色."
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在那裡,大家開始說:
「我們發揮著作用。」
04:42
So when I speak說話 to these leaders領導者, I say,
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當我和這些領導者交談時,我說:
04:45
"Look, you could be the CEOCEO,
a very successful成功 CEOCEO of a company公司,
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「瞧,你可以是一間公司中
非常成功的執行長,
04:49
but you could also be a steward管家."
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但你也可以當個管家。」
04:51
And that's the key word.
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那就是關鍵字。
04:52
"You could be a steward管家
of the power功率 you have
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「你能當個管家,用你擁有的力量,
04:56
to shape形狀 the lives生活 and the economies經濟
of billions數十億 of people.
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來塑造數十億人的生活和經濟。
05:00
Which哪一個 one do you want to be?"
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你想要當哪一種人?」
05:03
And the answer回答 is,
it's not one or the other.
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答案是,這並不是二選一的。
05:06
This is what we are missing失踪 right now.
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這正是我們現在所缺乏的。
05:09
So when an adult成人 like Brad布拉德 Smith工匠,
the president主席 of Microsoft微軟,
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當像微軟的總裁布拉德 · 史密斯
這樣的成人在幾個月前說:
05:13
said a few少數 months個月 ago,
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05:14
"We need a new set of Geneva日內瓦 Conventions約定
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「我們需要一套新的日內瓦公約
05:17
to manage管理 the security安全
of the digital數字 space空間,"
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來管理數位空間的安全性。」
05:20
many許多 of the senior前輩 leaders領導者
in Silicon Valley
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矽谷的許多資深領導者
05:23
actually其實 spoke against反對 his words.
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其實是跟他唱反調的。
05:27
"What do you mean, Geneva日內瓦 Convention慣例?
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「你說日內瓦公約是什麼意思?
05:29
We don't need any Geneva日內瓦 Conventions約定.
We self-regulate自我調節."
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我們不需要什麼日內瓦公約,
我們會做自我規範。」
05:32
But that mood心情 is changing改變,
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但那種氣氛正在改變,
05:34
and I'm starting開始 to see many許多 leaders領導者 say,
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我開始看到許多領導者說:
05:37
"Help us out."
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「幫我們擺脫困難。」
05:39
But here lies the conundrum難題.
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但難題就在這裡。
05:41
Who is going to help those leaders領導者
do the right thing?
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誰會協助那些領導者做正確的事?
05:44
BFBF: So who is going to help them?
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布:所以,誰會協助他們?
05:47
Because I'd love
to interview訪問 you for an hour小時,
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雖然我很想訪問你一個小時,
05:51
but give me your biggest最大 fear恐懼
and your best最好 hope希望
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但請告訴我,
針對這個問題要如何解,
你最大的恐懼
和最大的希望是什麼。
05:56
for how this is going to work out.
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06:00
FCFC: My biggest最大 hope希望
is that we will become成為 each stewards管家
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法:我最大的希望是
我們都會變成
這個數位新世界的管家。
06:07
of this new digital數字 world世界.
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06:09
That's my biggest最大 hope希望,
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那是我最大的希望,
因為,我確實認為,
06:10
because I do think, often經常,
we want to put the blame on others其他.
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通常,我們想要怪罪他人。
06:15
"Oh, it's these CEOs老總.
They're behaving行為 this way."
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「喔,都怪這些執行長。
因為他們這樣做。」
06:18
"These governments政府 are not doing enough足夠."
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「這些政府做得還不夠。」
06:20
But how about us?
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但我們呢?
06:21
How is each of us actually其實 taking服用
the responsibility責任 to be a steward管家
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我們每個人是怎樣真正承擔起責任,
在我們所居住的數位
空間中行使管家的職責?
06:27
of the digital數字 space空間 we live生活 in?
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06:29
And one of the things I've been pushing推動
on university大學 presidents總統
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我一直在催促大學校長
去做的事情之一,
06:32
is we need every一切 engineering工程 and science科學
and computer電腦 science科學 student學生
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就是我們需要每一位工程、
自然科學和計算機科學的學生,
06:36
who is about to write
the next下一個 line of code
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在他們將要寫下一行程式碼之前,
06:39
or design設計 the next下一個 IoT很多 device設備
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或設計出下一個物聯網裝置之前,
06:41
to actually其實 have in them
a sense of responsibility責任 and stewardship管家
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就要對他們在打造的東西
真正地懷有責任感和管家的精神。
06:46
towards what they're building建造.
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06:48
So I suggested建議 we create創建 a new oath誓言,
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所以,我建議我們創造新的誓詞,
06:50
like the Hippocratic希波克拉底 Oath誓言,
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就像希波克拉底誓詞
(醫生誓詞),
06:52
so that every一切 student學生
entering進入 an engineering工程 program程序
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讓參與工程計畫的每一位學生
06:55
takes a technocratic技術專家 oath誓言 or a wisdom智慧 oath誓言
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都要先唸一段
技術專家誓詞或智慧誓詞,
06:58
or some oath誓言 of commitment承諾
to the rest休息 of us.
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或是某種我們對其他人
有所承諾的誓詞。
07:01
That's my best最好 hope希望, that we all rise上升.
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那是我最大的希望:
我們通通都能站起來。
07:04
Because governments政府 and businesses企業
will fight鬥爭 over this power功率 game遊戲,
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因為政府和企業
會為了這場權力遊戲而戰,
07:09
but where are we?
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但我們在哪裡?
07:10
And unless除非 we play into that power功率 table,
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除非我們也參加這場權力遊戲,
07:15
I think we'll end結束 up in a bad place地點.
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不然我們最後會淪落到很糟的處境。
07:18
My biggest最大 fear恐懼?
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我最大的恐懼?
07:21
My biggest最大 fear恐懼,
to be very tactical戰術 today今天,
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現在我最大的恐懼,
非常戰術性地來說,
07:24
what is keeping保持 me up at night
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讓我晚上難以入眠的,
07:26
is the current當前 war戰爭 between之間
the West西, the liberal自由主義的 world世界,
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5714
是目前西方自由世界
和中國之間
07:33
and China中國,
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在人工智慧領域的戰爭。
07:34
in the area of artificial人造 intelligence情報.
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07:37
There is a real真實 war戰爭 going on,
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有一場真實的戰爭正在發生。
07:39
and for those of us who have lived生活
through通過 the nuclear nonproliferation防 擴散 age年齡
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我們這些人,經歷過
防止核武器擴散時代,
07:44
and saw how people agreed約定
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看見過大家都同意
07:46
to take some very dangerous危險
things off the table,
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將一些非常危險的東西收起來。
07:50
well, the Carnegie卡內基 Endowment天賦
just finished a study研究.
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3323
嗯,卡內基基金會
剛完成一項研究。
07:54
They talked to every一切 country國家
that made製作 nuclear weapons武器
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他們和每一個製造
核武的國家談過,
07:57
and asked them,
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問他們:
07:59
"Which哪一個 digital數字 'weapon'"武器"
would you take off the table
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「在對抗其他國家的學校
或醫院時,如果要你選擇,
你會將哪一項數位『武器』收起來?」
08:04
against反對 somebody else's別人的
schools學校 or hospitals醫院?"
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08:07
And the answer回答 --
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而這個問題的答案,
握有核武的強權的答案,就是
08:09
from every一切 nuclear power功率 --
to this question was,
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08:13
nothing.
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沒有。
08:15
That's what I'm worried擔心 about ...
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那就是我在擔心的……
08:18
The weaponization武器化 of the digital數字 space空間,
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數位空間被武器化,
以及為了這個目標所做的競爭。
08:21
and the race種族 to get there.
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08:22
BFBF: Well, it sounds聲音 like
you've got a lot of work to do,
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布:聽起來你還有好多工作要做,
08:25
and so do the rest休息 of us.
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我們其他人也一樣。
08:27
Fadi法迪, thank you so much.
I really appreciate欣賞 it.
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法迪,非常感謝你。十分感謝。
08:29
FCFC: Thank you.
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法:謝謝你。
08:31
(Applause掌聲)
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(掌聲)
Translated by Lilian Chiu
Reviewed by Wilde Luo

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ABOUT THE SPEAKERS
Fadi Chehadé - Technologist, entrepreneur
Fadi Chehadé is focused on finding ways for society to benefit from technology and strengthening international cooperation in the digital space.

Why you should listen

Fadi Chehadé is a serial entrepreneur who has founded and led several companies in the digital space including Vocado LLC (acquired by Oracle in 2018) and Viacore (purchased by IBM in 2006). He is an advisory board member with the World Economic Forum's Center for the Fourth Industrial Revolution that focuses on maximizing the benefits of science and technology for society. Chehadé is also a member of the UN Secretary-General’s High-Level Panel on Digital Cooperation that will advance proposals to strengthen international cooperation in the digital space.  

Chehadé serves on the corporate boards of Sentry Data Systems and Interactions LLC and the advisory board of the University of Southern California’s Center on Public Diplomacy. For two years, he was a Senior Advisor to Prof. Klaus Schwab, Executive Chairman of the World Economic Forum, where he focused on public-private cooperation to address issues affecting the digital economy. As former President and CEO of ICANN, the global authority managing the Internet's logical infrastructure and ensuring "one" internet for the world, Chehadé guided its historic transition to an independent transnational institution governed jointly by private, public and civic stakeholders.

More profile about the speaker
Fadi Chehadé | Speaker | TED.com
Bryn Freedman - Editorial director and curator, TED Institute
Bryn Freedman helps those who want to give the "talk of their lives" in a clear, passionate and authentic way.

Why you should listen

Award-winning TV producer, investigative journalist and author, Bryn Freedman joined TED in 2014 as the editorial director and curator for the TED Institute. In her work with TED, Freedman creates and executes TED conference events for Fortune 500 companies, overseeing all editorial content as well as managing speaker coaches and determining both the topics for each talk and the overall conference theme. In addition to curating these events, she works as an executive speaker coach for professionals who want to give the "talk of their lives" in a clear, passionate and authentic way.

Freedman is also co-founder of Voices4Freedom, an international organization aimed at eradicating slavery through education and media.

More profile about the speaker
Bryn Freedman | Speaker | TED.com