TED2019
Carole Cadwalladr: Facebook's role in Brexit -- and the threat to democracy
卡罗尔•卡德瓦拉德: Facebook在英国脱欧中扮演的角色——以及对民主的威胁
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在这一次不容错过的演讲中，记者卡罗尔•卡德瓦拉德深入探讨了近年来最令人困惑的事件之一：英国2016年的脱欧公投。Facebook将误导性广告有意对脱欧摇摆不定的选民进行投放，卡罗尔对该行为进行跟踪调查——这一切让人不禁联想起2016年美国总统选举中相同的操纵者，相同的策略。卡德瓦拉德指出硅谷的“科技众神”站在了历史错误的一边，并且发出疑问：自由和公平的选举是否已经成为过去?
Carole Cadwalladr - Investigative journalist
Carole Cadwalladr is a British investigative journalist and features writer. Full bio
Carole Cadwalladr is a British investigative journalist and features writer. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
2016年6月,
英国脱欧投票
英国脱欧投票
00:13
So, on the day after the Brexit vote,
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00:16
in June 2016,
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结束后的那天，
00:19
when Britain woke up to the shock
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当英国醒来后，
00:21
of discovering that we're leaving
the European Union,
the European Union,
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震惊地发现我们将要离开欧盟，
00:24
my editor at the "Observer"
newspaper in the UK
newspaper in the UK
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我在英国《观察者》报纸的编辑
00:27
asked me to go back to South Wales,
where I grew up, and to write a report.
where I grew up, and to write a report.
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让我回到威尔士南部去写一份报告，
那是我长大的地方。
那是我长大的地方。
00:32
And so I went to a town called Ebbw Vale.
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于是我去了一个叫埃布谷的小镇。
00:35
Here it is.
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就在这儿。
00:36
It's in the South Wales Valleys,
which is this quite special place.
which is this quite special place.
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它位于南威尔士山谷，
这是一个非常特别的地方。
这是一个非常特别的地方。
00:40
So it's had this very, sort of rich,
working-class culture,
working-class culture,
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这里有着浓厚的工人阶级文化，
00:45
and it's famous for its Welsh
male voice choirs and rugby and its coal.
male voice choirs and rugby and its coal.
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以威尔士男声合唱团、橄榄球和
煤炭而闻名。
煤炭而闻名。
00:50
But when I was a teenager,
the coal mines and the steelworks closed,
the coal mines and the steelworks closed,
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但当我十几岁的时候，
煤矿和钢铁厂都倒闭了，
煤矿和钢铁厂都倒闭了，
00:54
and the entire area was devastated.
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整个地区都衰落了。
00:57
And I went there because it had one of
the highest "Leave" votes in the country.
the highest "Leave" votes in the country.
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我去那里是因为那里出现了
全国最高的“脱欧”票比例。
全国最高的“脱欧”票比例。
01:01
Sixty-two percent of the people here
voted to leave the European Union.
voted to leave the European Union.
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这里62%的人投票决定离开欧盟。
01:06
And I wanted to know why.
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我想知道为什么。
01:09
When I got there,
I was just a bit taken aback,
I was just a bit taken aback,
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当我到达那里的时候，
我只是有点吃惊，
我只是有点吃惊，
01:11
because the last time I went to Ebbw Vale,
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因为上次我去埃布谷的时候，
01:14
it looked like this.
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它看起来是这样的。
01:16
And now, it looks like this.
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现在，它看起来像这样。
01:19
This is a new 33-million-pound
college of further education
college of further education
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这是一所耗资3300万英镑的
继续教育大学，
继续教育大学，
01:24
that was mostly funded
by the European Union.
by the European Union.
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主要由欧盟资助。
01:28
And this is the new sports center
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这是一个新的体育中心，
01:31
that's at the middle of 350-million-pound
regeneration project
regeneration project
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这是由欧盟资助的3.5亿英镑的
01:36
that's being funded by the European Union.
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重建项目的中心。
01:40
And this is the new 77-million-pound
road-improvement scheme,
road-improvement scheme,
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这是一个新的7700万英镑的
道路改善计划，
道路改善计划，
01:44
and there's a new train line,
a new railway station,
a new railway station,
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还有一条新的铁路线，
一个新的火车站，
一个新的火车站，
01:47
and they're all being funded
by the European Union.
by the European Union.
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这些都是由欧盟资助的。
这并不是什么秘密，
01:49
And it's not as if
any of this is a secret,
any of this is a secret,
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因为到处都有这样的大标志。
01:51
because there's big signs
like this everywhere.
like this everywhere.
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[欧盟基金:投资威尔士]
01:53
[EU Funds: Investing in Wales]
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(笑声)
01:55
(Laughter)
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01:57
I had this sort of
weird sense of unreality,
weird sense of unreality,
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在小镇上散步的时候，
01:59
walking around the town.
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我时不时有一种
奇怪的不真实的感觉。
奇怪的不真实的感觉。
02:01
And it came to a head
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当我走到体育中心
遇到这个年轻人的时候，
遇到这个年轻人的时候，
02:03
when I met this young man
in front of the sports center.
in front of the sports center.
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我的想法达到了顶点。
02:07
And he told me that he had voted to leave,
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他告诉我，他投票决定离开欧盟，
02:11
because the European Union
had done nothing for him.
had done nothing for him.
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因为欧盟没有为他做任何事情。
02:17
He was fed up with it.
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他受够了。
02:19
And all around town,
people told me the same thing.
people told me the same thing.
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镇上的人都跟我说了同样的话。
02:23
They said that they wanted
to take back control,
to take back control,
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他们说他们想夺回控制权，
02:26
which was one of the slogans
in the campaign.
in the campaign.
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这是竞选口号之一。
02:29
And they told me
that they were most fed up
that they were most fed up
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他们告诉我，
他们受够了移民和难民。
02:31
with the immigrants and with the refugees.
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02:34
They'd had enough.
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移民已经太多了。
02:36
Which was odd.
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这太奇怪了。
02:38
Because walking around,
I didn't meet any immigrants or refugees.
I didn't meet any immigrants or refugees.
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因为走了这么久，
我没有遇到一个移民或难民。
我没有遇到一个移民或难民。
02:41
I met one Polish woman who told me
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我遇到一位波兰妇女，她告诉我
02:43
she was practically
the only foreigner in town.
the only foreigner in town.
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她几乎是镇上唯一的外国人。
02:45
And when I checked the figures,
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当我查看这些数据时，
02:47
I discovered that Ebbw Vale actually has
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我发现埃布谷实际上
02:49
one of the lowest rates
of immigration in the country.
of immigration in the country.
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是英国移民率最低的地区之一。
02:53
And so I was just a bit baffled,
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所以我有点困惑，
因为我不能真正理解
02:54
because I couldn't really understand
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人们从哪里得到了信息。
02:56
where people were getting
their information from.
their information from.
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因为正是右翼小报
02:59
Because it was the right-wing
tabloid newspapers
tabloid newspapers
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刊登了所有关于移民的报道。
03:01
which printed all these stories
about immigration.
about immigration.
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但这里一个非常左翼的工党大本营。
03:03
And this is a very much
left-wing Labour stronghold.
left-wing Labour stronghold.
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03:08
But then after the article came out,
this woman got in touch with me.
this woman got in touch with me.
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但文章发表后，
有个女人和我取得了联系。
有个女人和我取得了联系。
03:11
And she was from Ebbw Vale,
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她来自埃布谷，
03:13
and she told me about all this stuff
that she'd seen on Facebook.
that she'd seen on Facebook.
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她把在Facebook上看到的东西
全部告诉了我。
全部告诉了我。
我说，“什么东西?”
03:16
I was like, "What stuff?"
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她说移民问题非常可怕，
03:18
And she said it was all this quite scary
stuff about immigration,
stuff about immigration,
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尤其是土耳其。
03:21
and especially about Turkey.
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03:22
So I tried to find it.
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所以我试着找到她所说的消息。
03:24
But there was nothing there.
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但是什么也没有。
03:26
Because there's no archive
of ads that people had seen
of ads that people had seen
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因为没有相关的档案，
来保存人们看过的广告
来保存人们看过的广告
03:30
or what had been pushed
into their news feeds.
into their news feeds.
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或新闻媒体流推送的内容
也没有被保存。
也没有被保存。
没有任何痕迹，完全没有线索。
03:34
No trace of anything,
gone completely dark.
gone completely dark.
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03:38
And this referendum that will have
this profound effect forever on Britain --
this profound effect forever on Britain --
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这次公投将对英国产生深远的影响——
03:44
it's already had a profound effect:
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它已经产生了深远的影响：
03:47
the Japanese car manufacturers
that came to Wales and the north east
that came to Wales and the north east
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之前威尔士和东北部的
日本汽车制造商
日本汽车制造商
03:50
to replace the mining jobs --
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曾取代矿业工作——
现在他们已经因为英国脱欧而离开了。
03:51
they are already going because of Brexit.
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03:54
And this entire referendum
took place in darkness,
took place in darkness,
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整个公投发生在黑暗中，
03:59
because it took place on Facebook.
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因为它发生在Facebook上。
04:03
And what happens on Facebook
stays on Facebook,
stays on Facebook,
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Facebook上发生的事情
只会留在Facebook圈子里，
只会留在Facebook圈子里，
04:08
because only you see your news feed,
and then it vanishes,
and then it vanishes,
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因为只有你看到你的新闻推送，
然后它就消失了，
然后它就消失了，
04:11
so it's impossible to research anything.
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所以无法研究任何东西。
04:13
So we have no idea who saw what ads
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所以我们不知道谁看到了什么广告，
04:16
or what impact they had,
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这些广告又产生了什么影响，
04:18
or what data was used
to target these people.
to target these people.
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或者这些推送是基于哪些数据的。
04:21
Or even who placed the ads,
or how much money was spent,
or how much money was spent,
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甚至是谁投放了广告，花了多少钱，
04:24
or even what nationality they were.
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甚至这些人的国籍是什么。
04:28
But Facebook does.
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但是Facebook知晓这些秘密。
04:31
Facebook has these answers,
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Facebook有这些问题的答案，
04:33
and it's refused to give them to us.
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但它拒绝告诉我们。
04:36
Our parliament has asked Mark Zuckerberg
multiple times to come to Britain
multiple times to come to Britain
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我们的议会已经多次要求
马克·扎克伯格来英国
马克·扎克伯格来英国
04:41
and to give us these answers.
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给我们解释这些疑问。
04:43
And every single time, he's refused.
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每一次，他都拒绝了。
04:47
And you have to wonder why.
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你一定想知道他为什么不来。
04:50
Because what I and other
journalists have uncovered
journalists have uncovered
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因为我和其他记者发现，
04:53
is that multiple crimes
took place during the referendum.
took place during the referendum.
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公投期间发生了多起犯罪。
04:56
And they took place on Facebook.
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而且这些犯罪
就发生在Facebook上。
就发生在Facebook上。
05:00
It's because in Britain,
we limit the amount of money
we limit the amount of money
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因为在英国，我们限制你
05:03
that you can spend in an election.
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在选举中可以花的钱。
05:05
And it's because in the 19th century,
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这是因为在19世纪，
05:07
people would walk around
with literally wheelbarrows of cash
with literally wheelbarrows of cash
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人们真的会带着一手推车的现金
四处走动，
四处走动，
05:11
and just buy voters.
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然后收买选民。
05:13
So we passed these strict laws
to stop that from happening.
to stop that from happening.
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所以我们通过了这些严格的法律
来阻止这种情况的发生。
来阻止这种情况的发生。
05:18
But those laws don't work anymore.
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但是那些法律现在已经不管用了。
05:20
This referendum took place
almost entirely online.
almost entirely online.
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这次公投几乎完全是在网上进行的。
05:24
And you can spend any amount of money
on Facebook or on Google or on YouTube ads
on Facebook or on Google or on YouTube ads
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你可以在Facebook、谷歌或
YouTube上花很多钱，
YouTube上花很多钱，
05:28
and nobody will know,
because they're black boxes.
because they're black boxes.
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没人会知道，因为它们经过”黑盒操作“，
没人知道其内部运作。
没人知道其内部运作。
05:31
And this is what happened.
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事情就是这样。
05:34
We've actually got no idea
of the full extent of it.
of the full extent of it.
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实际上，我们并不知道它的全部范围。
05:37
But we do know that in the last days
before the Brexit vote,
before the Brexit vote,
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但我们知道的是，
在英国脱欧公投前的最后几天，
在英国脱欧公投前的最后几天，
05:40
the official "Vote Leave" campaign
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官方的“脱欧公投”活动通过另一个
竞选实体洗钱
05:42
laundered nearly three quarters
of a million pounds
of a million pounds
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05:46
through another campaign entity
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近75万英镑，
05:49
that our electoral commission
has ruled was illegal,
has ruled was illegal,
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我们的选举委员会裁定
该实体是非法的，
该实体是非法的，
05:52
and it's referred it to the police.
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并将其提交给了警方。
05:55
And with this illegal cash,
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用这些非法资金，
05:59
"Vote Leave" unleashed
a fire hose of disinformation.
a fire hose of disinformation.
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“脱欧公投”引发了一连串虚假信息。
06:05
Ads like this.
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就像这样的广告。
06:06
[Turkey's 76m people joining the EU]
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(土耳其7600万人加入欧盟)
06:08
This is a lie, it's a total lie.
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这是个谎言，是个彻彻底底的谎言。
06:10
Turkey is not joining the European Union.
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土耳其不会加入欧盟。
06:12
There's not even any discussions
of it joining the European Union.
of it joining the European Union.
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甚至没有任何关于它加入欧盟的讨论。
06:17
And most of us, we never saw these ads,
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而我们大多数人，
我们从来没有见过这些广告，
我们从来没有见过这些广告，
06:20
because we were not the target of them.
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因为我们不是他们的目标。
06:22
"Vote Leave" identified
a tiny sliver of people
a tiny sliver of people
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“脱欧公投”寻找了一小部分
被认为会动摇的人，
被认为会动摇的人，
06:26
who it identified as persuadable,
and they saw them.
and they saw them.
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他们看到了这些广告。
06:29
And the only reason
we are seeing these now
we are seeing these now
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我们现在看到这些的唯一原因
06:32
is because parliament forced
Facebook to hand them over.
Facebook to hand them over.
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是因为议会强迫Facebook
交出了它们。
交出了它们。
06:37
And maybe you think,
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也许你会想，
06:38
"Well, it was just a bit of overspending.
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“嗯，只是有点不太像话。
06:40
It's a few lies."
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只是几个谎言而已。”
06:42
But this was the biggest electoral fraud
in Britain for 100 years.
in Britain for 100 years.
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但这是英国100年来
最大的选举舞弊。
最大的选举舞弊。
06:49
In a once-in-a-generation vote
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这是一代人只可能参与一次，
06:52
that hinged upon just
one percent of the electorate.
one percent of the electorate.
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而只有1%的选民参与的投票。
06:59
And it was just one of the crimes
that took place in the referendum.
that took place in the referendum.
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这只是公投中发生的罪行之一。
07:03
There was another group,
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还有另一个组织，
07:04
which was headed
by this man, Nigel Farage,
by this man, Nigel Farage,
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由这个人领导，奈杰尔·法拉奇，
07:09
the one to the right of Trump.
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特朗普右边的那个。
07:11
And his group, "Leave.EU" --
it also broke the law.
it also broke the law.
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和他的团队，“离开欧盟”
——它也违反了法律。
——它也违反了法律。
07:15
It broke British electoral laws
and British data laws,
and British data laws,
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它违反了英国选举法和数据法，
07:18
and it's also being
referred to the police.
referred to the police.
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也被提交给了警方。
07:22
And this man, Arron Banks,
he funded this campaign.
he funded this campaign.
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这个人，阿伦·班克斯，
资助了这次竞选。
资助了这次竞选。
07:27
And in a completely separate case,
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在另一个不相关的案件中，
07:30
he's being referred
to our National Crime Agency,
to our National Crime Agency,
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他被移交给我们的国家犯罪局，
07:34
our equivalent of the FBI,
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相当于美国的联邦调查局，
07:36
because our electoral commission
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因为我们的选举委员会得出结论，
07:38
has concluded they don't know
where his money came from.
where his money came from.
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他们不知道他的钱从哪里来。
07:41
Or if it was even British.
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究竟是不是来自英国的资金。
07:44
And I'm not even going to go into
the lies that Arron Banks has told
the lies that Arron Banks has told
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我甚至不用去细说
阿伦·班克斯所说的
阿伦·班克斯所说的
07:49
about his covert relationship
with the Russian government.
with the Russian government.
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关于他与俄罗斯政府秘密关系的谎言。
07:54
Or the weird timing of Nigel Farage's
meetings with Julian Assange
meetings with Julian Assange
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或者是奈杰尔·法拉奇(脱欧党党魁)
与朱利安·阿桑奇(维基解密主角)
与朱利安·阿桑奇(维基解密主角)
07:58
and with Trump's buddy,
Roger Stone, now indicted,
Roger Stone, now indicted,
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以及特朗普的好友罗杰·斯通，
他如今正被起诉，会面的奇怪时间，
他如今正被起诉，会面的奇怪时间，
08:01
immediately before
two massive WikiLeaks dumps,
two massive WikiLeaks dumps,
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就在维基解密公布两份大规模文件之前，
08:05
both of which happened
to benefit Donald Trump.
to benefit Donald Trump.
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这两份文件都恰好有利于
唐纳德·特朗普。
唐纳德·特朗普。
08:07
But I will tell you that Brexit
and Trump were intimately entwined.
and Trump were intimately entwined.
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但我要告诉你的是，
英国脱欧和特朗普密不可分。
英国脱欧和特朗普密不可分。
08:12
This man told me that Brexit
was the petri dish for Trump.
was the petri dish for Trump.
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这个人告诉我，
英国退欧是特朗普的培养皿。
英国退欧是特朗普的培养皿。
08:18
And we know it's the same people,
the same companies,
the same companies,
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我们知道是同样的人，同样的公司，
同样的数据，同样的技术，
08:20
the same data, the same techniques,
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08:22
the same use of hate and fear.
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同样利用了仇恨和恐惧。
08:24
This is what they
were posting on Facebook.
were posting on Facebook.
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这是他们在Facebook上发布的。
08:27
And I don't even want to call this a lie,
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我甚至不想称之为谎言，
08:30
[Immigration without assimilation
equals invasion]
equals invasion]
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【没有经历同化的移民等于入侵】
08:32
because it feels more
like a hate crime to me.
like a hate crime to me.
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因为对我来说，这更像是一种仇恨犯罪。
08:38
I don't have to tell you
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我不必告诉你，
08:40
that hate and fear are being sown online
all across the world.
all across the world.
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仇恨和恐惧
正在世界各地的网络上散播。
正在世界各地的网络上散播。
08:46
Not just in Britain and America,
but in France and in Hungary
but in France and in Hungary
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不仅在英国和美国，
而且在法国、匈牙利、
而且在法国、匈牙利、
08:49
and Brazil and Myanmar and New Zealand.
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巴西、缅甸和新西兰。
08:52
And we know there is this dark undertow
which is connecting us all globally.
which is connecting us all globally.
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我们觉察到有一股黑色的暗流
将我们连接在一起。
将我们连接在一起。
08:57
And it is flowing
via the technology platforms.
via the technology platforms.
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它通过技术平台流动。
09:02
But we only see a tiny amount
of what's going on on the surface.
of what's going on on the surface.
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但我们只能看到表面上的一小部分。
09:07
And I only found out anything
about this dark underbelly
about this dark underbelly
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我也只发现了
关于这个黑暗面的冰山一角，
关于这个黑暗面的冰山一角，
09:12
because I started looking into
Trump's relationship to Farage,
Trump's relationship to Farage,
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因为我开始调查
特朗普和法拉奇的关系，
特朗普和法拉奇的关系，
09:15
into a company called Cambridge Analytica.
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我发现了一家叫剑桥分析的公司。
09:18
And I spent months tracking down
an ex-employee, Christopher Wiley.
an ex-employee, Christopher Wiley.
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我花了好几个月的时间
才找到前雇员克里斯托弗·威利。
才找到前雇员克里斯托弗·威利。
09:23
And he told me how this company,
that worked for both Trump and Brexit,
that worked for both Trump and Brexit,
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他向我解释，
这家为特朗普和英国脱欧运作的公司
这家为特朗普和英国脱欧运作的公司
09:28
had profiled people politically
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是如何从政治上剖析人们的，
09:31
in order to understand
their individual fears,
their individual fears,
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以便理解他们个人的恐惧，
09:35
to better target them with Facebook ads.
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从而更好地用
Facebook广告瞄准他们。
Facebook广告瞄准他们。
09:39
And it did this by illicitly
harvesting the profiles
harvesting the profiles
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它通过非法获取Facebook上
09:44
of 87 million people from Facebook.
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8700万人的用户资料来做到这一点。
09:50
It took an entire year's work
to get Christopher on the record.
to get Christopher on the record.
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我花了整整一年才把克里斯托弗
记录在案。
记录在案。
09:55
And I had to turn myself
from a feature writer
from a feature writer
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我不得不把自己从特写作家
09:57
into an investigative reporter to do it.
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变成调查记者。
10:00
And he was extraordinarily brave,
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他非常勇敢，
10:02
because the company
is owned by Robert Mercer,
is owned by Robert Mercer,
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因为这家公司的所有者
是为特朗普提供资金的
是为特朗普提供资金的
亿万富翁罗伯特·默瑟，
10:05
the billionaire who bankrolled Trump,
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10:07
and he threatened
to sue us multiple times,
to sue us multiple times,
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他多次威胁要起诉我们，
10:10
to stop us from publishing.
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阻止我们出版。
10:13
But we finally got there,
and we were one day ahead of publication.
and we were one day ahead of publication.
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但我们最终还是做到了，
离出版还有一天。
离出版还有一天。
10:16
We got another legal threat.
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我们受到了另一个法律威胁。
10:19
Not from Cambridge Analytica this time,
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这次不是来自剑桥分析公司，
10:21
but from Facebook.
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而是来自Facebook。
10:24
It told us that if we publish,
they would sue us.
they would sue us.
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它告诉我们，如果我们出版，
他们会起诉我们。
他们会起诉我们。
10:28
We did it anyway.
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我们仍然出版了。
10:30
(Applause)
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(掌声)
10:40
Facebook, you were
on the wrong side of history in that.
on the wrong side of history in that.
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Facebook，
你们选择站在历史错误的一边。
你们选择站在历史错误的一边。
你们站在历史错误的一边，
因为你们
因为你们
10:44
And you were on the wrong side
of history in this --
of history in this --
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拒绝给出我们需要的真相。
10:48
in refusing to give us
the answers that we need.
the answers that we need.
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这就是我来这里的原因。
10:52
And that is why I am here.
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直接对你们说，硅谷的众神们。
10:55
To address you directly,
the gods of Silicon Valley.
the gods of Silicon Valley.
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(掌声)
10:59
(Applause)
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马克·扎克伯格……
11:03
Mark Zuckerberg ...
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11:05
(Applause)
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(掌声)
谢丽尔·桑德伯格（脸书CEO）、
拉里·佩奇（谷歌母公司CEO）、
拉里·佩奇（谷歌母公司CEO）、
11:06
and Sheryl Sandberg and Larry Page
and Sergey Brin and Jack Dorsey,
and Sergey Brin and Jack Dorsey,
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谢尔盖·布林（谷歌联合创始人）、
杰克·多尔西（推特创始人CEO），
杰克·多尔西（推特创始人CEO），
还有你们的员工和投资者。
11:15
and your employees
and your investors, too.
and your investors, too.
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因为100年前，
11:19
Because 100 years ago,
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南威尔士煤矿最大的危险是煤气。
11:21
the biggest danger in the South Wales
coal mines was gas.
coal mines was gas.
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11:24
Silent and deadly and invisible.
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沉默，致命，隐形。
这就是为什么他们先派金丝雀
去检查空气。
去检查空气。
11:26
It's why they sent the canaries
down first to check the air.
down first to check the air.
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11:29
And in this massive, global, online
experiment that we are all living through,
experiment that we are all living through,
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在这个大规模的、全球性的、
在线的实验中，我们都置身其中，
在线的实验中，我们都置身其中，
11:33
we in Britain are the canary.
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我们英国人就是金丝雀。
当一百年来的选举法被科技打乱时，
11:36
We are what happens to a western democracy
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11:39
when a hundred years of electoral laws
are disrupted by technology.
are disrupted by technology.
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我们就是活生生的
所谓西方民主国家的下场。
所谓西方民主国家的下场。
我们的民主被破坏了，
我们的法律不再有效，
我们的法律不再有效，
11:45
Our democracy is broken,
our laws don't work anymore,
our laws don't work anymore,
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11:48
and it's not me saying this,
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这不是我说的，
11:50
it's our parliament published
a report saying this.
a report saying this.
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而是我们的议会发表了一份报告。
你们发明的这项技术太神奇了。
11:55
This technology that you have
invented has been amazing.
invented has been amazing.
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但现在，这里是犯罪现场。
12:00
But now, it's a crime scene.
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你有证据。
12:03
And you have the evidence.
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但是你们仅仅说
将来会做得更好是不够的。
将来会做得更好是不够的。
12:07
And it is not enough to say
that you will do better in the future.
that you will do better in the future.
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因为要想阻止这种事情再次发生，
12:12
Because to have any hope
of stopping this from happening again,
of stopping this from happening again,
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我们必须知道真相。
12:17
we have to know the truth.
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12:21
And maybe you think,
"Well, it was just a few ads.
"Well, it was just a few ads.
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也许你会想，
“没事儿，这只是几个广告而已。
“没事儿，这只是几个广告而已。
12:24
And people are smarter than that, right?"
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人们比这更聪明，不会中招对吧?”
12:28
To which I would say,
"Good luck with that."
"Good luck with that."
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对此我要说：“祝你好运。”
因为脱欧公投表明，
12:32
Because what the Brexit vote demonstrates
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12:35
is that liberal democracy is broken.
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自由民主已经破碎。
12:39
And you broke it.
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你们把它弄坏了。
这不是民主——
12:42
This is not democracy --
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在黑暗之中散布谎言，
用非法的现金支付，
用非法的现金支付，
12:44
spreading lies in darkness,
paid for with illegal cash,
paid for with illegal cash,
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12:50
from God knows where.
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天知道这些现金从哪里来。
这是对国家的 颠覆，
12:53
It's subversion,
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而你们都是它的陪葬品。
12:55
and you are accessories to it.
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(掌声)
13:00
(Applause)
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13:09
Our parliament has been
the first in the world
the first in the world
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我们的议会是世界上第一个
13:13
to try to hold you to account,
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试图让你们承担责任的议会，
13:15
and it's failed.
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但它失败了。
13:17
You are literally beyond the reach
of British law -- not just British laws,
of British law -- not just British laws,
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你们真的超出了英国法律的范围
——不仅仅是英国法律，
——不仅仅是英国法律，
13:22
this is nine parliaments,
nine countries are represented here,
nine countries are represented here,
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这是9个议会，9个国家的代表，
马克·扎克伯格却拒绝来作证。
13:25
who Mark Zuckerberg refused
to come and give evidence to.
to come and give evidence to.
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13:30
And what you don't seem to understand
is that this is bigger than you.
is that this is bigger than you.
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你似乎不明白这种精准投放的广告
远远比你强大。
远远比你强大。
13:35
And it's bigger than any of us.
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它比我们任何人都强大。
13:37
And it is not about left or right
or "Leave" or "Remain" or Trump or not.
or "Leave" or "Remain" or Trump or not.
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这与左派、右派、“脱欧”、
“留欧”、特朗普都无关。
“留欧”、特朗普都无关。
这关系到是否有可能再次
13:43
It's about whether it's actually possible
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举行一次自由公正的选举。
13:45
to have a free and fair
election ever again.
election ever again.
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13:48
Because as it stands, I don't think it is.
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因为就目前来看，我不抱任何希望。
13:52
And so my question to you is,
is this what you want?
is this what you want?
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所以我想问你们，
这就是你们想要的吗?
这就是你们想要的吗?
你希望历史就这样记住你吗：
13:57
Is this how you want
history to remember you:
history to remember you:
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你是世界各地正在兴起的
14:01
as the handmaidens to authoritarianism
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威权主义的奴仆?
14:05
that is on the rise all across the world?
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因为你的初衷是将人们联系起来。
14:10
Because you set out to connect people.
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14:13
And you are refusing to acknowledge
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但如今你们拒绝承认
14:15
that the same technology
is now driving us apart.
is now driving us apart.
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同样的技术正在把我们分开。
14:21
And my question to everybody else is,
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我对其他人的问题是，
14:23
is this what we want:
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这就是我们想要的吗：
14:25
to let them get away with it,
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让他们逍遥法外，
14:28
and to sit back and play with our phones,
as this darkness falls?
as this darkness falls?
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在黑暗降临的时候，坐下来玩手机?
14:34
The history of the South Wales Valleys
is of a fight for rights.
is of a fight for rights.
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南威尔士山谷的历史
是一场争取权利的斗争。
是一场争取权利的斗争。
14:40
And this is not a drill --
it's a point of inflection.
it's a point of inflection.
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这不是演习，这是一个转折点。
民主并非是应许的，
也不是必然的。
也不是必然的。
14:45
Democracy is not guaranteed,
and it is not inevitable,
and it is not inevitable,
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3620
14:49
and we have to fight and we have to win
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我们必须战斗，我们必须胜利，
14:51
and we cannot let these tech companies
have this unchecked power.
have this unchecked power.
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我们不能让这些科技公司
拥有这种不受约束的权力。
拥有这种不受约束的权力。
14:56
It's up to us -- you, me and all of us.
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这取决于我们——
你，我和我们所有人。
你，我和我们所有人。
14:59
We are the ones
who have to take back control.
who have to take back control.
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我们必须夺回控制权。
(掌声)
15:04
(Applause)
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(欢呼)
15:07
(Cheers)
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(掌声)
15:10
(Applause)
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ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Carole Cadwalladr - Investigative journalistCarole Cadwalladr is a British investigative journalist and features writer.
Why you should listen
Carole Cadwalladr is a journalist for the Guardian and Observer in the United Kingdom. She worked for a year with whistleblower Christopher Wylie to publish her investigation into Cambridge Analytica, which she shared with the New York Times. The investigation resulted in Mark Zuckerberg being called before Congress and Facebook losing more than $100 billion from its share price. She has also uncovered multiple crimes committed during the European referendum and evidence of Russian interference in Brexit. Her work has won a Polk Award and the Orwell Prize for political journalism, and she was named a Pulitzer Prize finalist for National Reporting in 2019. Of her award-winning work, judge Sir David Bell wrote: She "deserves high praise for the quality of her research and for her determination to shed fierce light on a story which seems by no means over yet. Orwell would have loved it."
Carole Cadwalladr | Speaker | TED.com