TED Residency
Sue Jaye Johnson: What we don't teach kids about sex
蘇潔伊強生: 我們教導孩子性愛時少教了什麼？
Filmed:
Readability: 3
3,419,225 views
身為父母，教導孩子性知識是我們的職責。但在這包含了生物和生殖的「那場談話」之外，我們還可以談許多不同層次的靈肉體驗。蘇潔伊強生推出「那場談話2.0」，讓我們學習教導孩子開發身體的各種感性，提供他們溝通與傳達慾望和情緒的語言－讓他們不要變得封閉或麻木。
Sue Jaye Johnson - Journalist, filmmaker, writer
TED Resident Sue Jaye Johnson explores the ways cultural expectations shape our public and private behavior. Full bio
TED Resident Sue Jaye Johnson explores the ways cultural expectations shape our public and private behavior. Full bio
Double-click the English transcript below to play the video.
00:12
I remember my aunt
brushing my hair when I was a child.
brushing my hair when I was a child.
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我還記得小時候，
姑姑幫我梳頭髮。
姑姑幫我梳頭髮。
00:16
I felt this tingling in my stomach,
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肚子裡那種搔癢的感受，
00:18
this swelling in my belly.
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慢慢鼓脹的熱度。
00:21
All her attention on me,
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她所有的注意力都在我身上，
00:23
just me.
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只在我身上。
00:25
My beautiful Aunt Bea,
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我美麗的畢雅姑姑，
00:27
stroking my hair
with a fine-bristled brush.
with a fine-bristled brush.
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用鬃毛梳一下
又一下梳著我的頭髮。
又一下梳著我的頭髮。
00:31
Do you have a memory like that
that you can feel in your body right now?
that you can feel in your body right now?
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你有沒有像這樣的記憶，
到現在還讓你記憶猶新？
到現在還讓你記憶猶新？
00:35
Before language,
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在語言出現之前，
00:37
we're all sensation.
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我們全靠感覺。
00:39
As children, that's how we learn
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孩提時代，我們用觸摸
界定自己在世上的位置
界定自己在世上的位置
00:40
to differentiate ourselves
in the world -- through touch.
in the world -- through touch.
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00:43
Everything goes in the mouth,
the hands, on the skin.
the hands, on the skin.
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把東西放進嘴裡、
抓在手上，或用皮膚去感覺。
抓在手上，或用皮膚去感覺。
00:47
Sensation --
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感性
00:48
it is the way that we first
experience love.
experience love.
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是我們最初體驗到愛的方式。
00:52
It's the basis of human connection.
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它是人類連結的基礎。
00:56
We want our children to grow up
to have healthy intimate relationships.
to have healthy intimate relationships.
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我們希望我們的孩子長大後
能有健康、親密的關係。
能有健康、親密的關係。
01:00
So as parents,
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身為父母，
01:01
one of the things that we do
is we teach our children about sex.
is we teach our children about sex.
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我們會做的其中一件事就是
教我們的孩子關於性愛的知識。
教我們的孩子關於性愛的知識。
我們有書籍幫助我們，
01:04
We have books to help us,
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01:06
we have sex ed at school for the basics.
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在學校也有基本的性教育。
01:08
There's porn to fill in the gaps --
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有色情書刊影片來填補中間的缺口，
01:11
and it will fill in the gaps.
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而它們確實填 滿 缺 口。
01:13
(Laughter)
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（笑聲）
01:14
We teach our children "the talk"
about biology and mechanics,
about biology and mechanics,
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我們教我們孩子的「那場談話」，
是關於生物的做法的，
是關於生物的做法的，
01:18
about pregnancy and safe sex,
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關於懷孕和安全性交的，
01:20
and that's what our kids grow up thinking
that sex is pretty much all about.
that sex is pretty much all about.
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在成長過程中，孩子大概就會
認定性愛就是全部了。
認定性愛就是全部了。
01:24
But we can do better than that.
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但我們能做得更好。
01:26
We can teach our sons and daughters
about pleasure and desire,
about pleasure and desire,
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我們能教導我們的兒子女兒
了解愉悅和慾望，
了解愉悅和慾望，
01:31
about consent and boundaries,
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同意和界線，
01:33
about what it feels like
to be present in their body
to be present in their body
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靈肉合一的感受，
01:37
and to know when they're not.
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和靈魂出竅的時刻。
01:39
And we do that in the ways
that we model touch, play,
that we model touch, play,
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而我們的做法是，
我們會模仿觸摸、玩樂、
我們會模仿觸摸、玩樂、
01:43
make eye contact --
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做眼神接觸－
01:45
all the ways that we engage their senses.
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動用感覺的各種方式。
01:48
We can teach our children
not just about sex,
not just about sex,
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我們能教孩子的不只是性愛，
01:50
but about sensuality.
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還有感性。
01:54
This is the kind of talk
that I needed as a girl.
that I needed as a girl.
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我小時候就需要這樣的談話。
01:56
I was extremely sensitive,
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我當時非常敏感，
01:58
but by the time I was an adolescent,
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但當我成了青少女之後，
02:00
I had numbed out.
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我麻木了。
02:02
The shame of boys mocking my changing body
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男孩們取笑我身體的改變，
讓我感到羞恥，
讓我感到羞恥，
02:04
and then girls exiling me for,
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女孩們因為我對男孩的興趣，
02:06
ironically, my interest in boys,
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而背棄我
02:09
it was so much.
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難以招架。
02:13
I didn't have any language
for what I was experiencing;
for what I was experiencing;
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我無法用言語形容
我當時所體驗到的；
我當時所體驗到的；
02:15
I didn't know it was going to pass.
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我不知道它會不會過去。
02:17
So I did the best thing
I could at the time
I could at the time
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所以我做了當時我能做的最佳決策，
02:20
and I checked out.
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我決定逃避。
02:22
And you can't isolate
just the difficult feelings,
just the difficult feelings,
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你不能只把難過的感受分離開來，
02:24
so I lost access to the joy,
the pleasure, the play,
the pleasure, the play,
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所以我也失去了樂趣、愉悅、玩樂，
02:27
and I spent decades like that,
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我數十年都那樣過日子，
02:28
with this his low-grade depression,
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帶著這種劣等的沮喪，
02:30
thinking that this is
what it meant to be a grown-up.
what it meant to be a grown-up.
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想著，原來當大人就是這麼一回事。
02:35
For the past year,
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過去一年，
02:36
I've been interviewing men and women
about their relationship to sex
about their relationship to sex
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我訪談了很多男男女女，
談他們和性愛的關係，
談他們和性愛的關係，
02:39
and I've heard my story again and again.
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我一次又一次聽到我的故事。
02:41
Girls who were told
they were too sensitive, too much.
they were too sensitive, too much.
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女孩們被別人說是太敏感、太過頭。
02:44
Boys who were taught to man up --
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男孩被別人教導要有男子氣概－
02:46
"don't be so emotional."
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「不要這麼情緒化。」
02:48
I learned I was not alone in checking out.
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我發現，我不是唯一逃避的人。
02:54
It was my daughter who reminded me
of how much I used to feel.
of how much I used to feel.
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是我女兒提醒了我，
讓我想起我以前的感受多深。
讓我想起我以前的感受多深。
03:00
We were at the beach.
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我們在海灘上。
03:01
It was this rare day.
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那是個難得的日子。
03:03
I turned off my cell phone,
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我把手機關機，
03:05
put in the calendar,
"Day at the beach with the girls."
"Day at the beach with the girls."
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在日曆上記著
「和女孩去海灘的日子」。
「和女孩去海灘的日子」。
03:08
I laid our towels down
just out of reach of the surf
just out of reach of the surf
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我把我們的毛巾放在
海浪剛好沖不到的地方，
海浪剛好沖不到的地方，
03:12
and fell asleep.
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然後就睡著了。
03:14
And when I woke up,
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當我醒來時，
03:15
I saw my daughter
drizzling sand on her arm like this,
drizzling sand on her arm like this,
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我看到我女兒把沙子
這樣灑在她的手臂上，
這樣灑在她的手臂上，
03:21
and I could feel that light tickle
of sand on her skin
of sand on her skin
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我可以感覺到她的皮膚因為
沙子造成輕微癢癢的感受，
沙子造成輕微癢癢的感受，
03:27
and I remembered my aunt brushing my hair.
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接著我就想起了我的姑姑幫我梳頭。
03:31
So I curled up next to her
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我爬到她旁邊，
03:32
and I drizzled sand on her other arm
and then her legs.
and then her legs.
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我把沙子灑到她的另一隻手臂上，
接著是她的雙腿上。
接著是她的雙腿上。
03:37
And then I said,
"Hey, you want me to bury you?"
"Hey, you want me to bury you?"
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接著，我說：「嘿，
你想要我把你埋起來嗎？」
你想要我把你埋起來嗎？」
03:41
And her eyes got really big
and she was like, "Yeah!"
and she was like, "Yeah!"
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她的眼睛睜得好大，說：「好啊！」
03:43
So we dug a hole
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所以我們挖了個洞，
03:45
and I covered her in sand and shells
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我用沙子和貝殼把她蓋起來，
03:46
and drew this little mermaid tail.
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畫出小美人魚的尾巴。
03:49
And then I took her home
and lathered her up in the shower
and lathered her up in the shower
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接著，我帶她回家，
03:52
and massaged her scalp
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按摩她的頭皮，
03:53
and I dried her off in a towel.
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用毛巾把她擦乾。
03:55
And I thought,
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我心想：
03:57
"Ah. How many times had I done that --
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「啊，每天我日復一日這麼做－
03:59
bathed her and dried her off --
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幫她洗澡，把她弄乾－
04:01
but had I ever stopped and paid attention
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但我是否曾經停下來留意
04:03
to the sensations
that I was creating for her?"
that I was creating for her?"
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她現在的感受？
我對待她的方式，
彷彿她正在一條裝配線上，
彷彿她正在一條裝配線上，
04:07
I'd been treating her
like she was on some assembly line
like she was on some assembly line
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04:10
of children needing to be fed
and put to bed.
and put to bed.
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需要被餵飽送上床
睡覺的孩子的裝配線。
睡覺的孩子的裝配線。
04:13
And I realized
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我突然意識到，
04:14
that when I dry my daughter off
in a towel tenderly the way a lover would,
in a towel tenderly the way a lover would,
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當我像情人般溫柔地
用毛巾把我女兒擦乾時，
用毛巾把我女兒擦乾時，
04:19
I'm teaching her
to expect that kind of touch.
to expect that kind of touch.
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我就是教導她去期待那樣子的觸碰。
04:24
I'm teaching her in that moment
about intimacy.
about intimacy.
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在那一刻，我在教導她什麼是親密。
04:27
About how to love her body
and respect her body.
and respect her body.
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教導她如何去愛、去尊敬她的身體。
04:31
I realized there are parts of the talk
that can't be conveyed in words.
that can't be conveyed in words.
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我了解到，「那場談話」
有一部份是無法用文字傳達的。
有一部份是無法用文字傳達的。
04:37
In her book, "Girls and Sex,"
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佩吉奧倫斯坦寫了一本書，
04:38
writer Peggy Orenstein finds
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叫「女孩與性」，在書中，她發現
04:41
that young women are focusing
on their partner's pleasure,
on their partner's pleasure,
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年輕女性會把焦點
放在讓伴侶愉悅上，
放在讓伴侶愉悅上，
04:44
not their own.
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而非讓自己愉悅。
04:47
This is something I'm going to talk about
with my girls when they're older,
with my girls when they're older,
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當女兒們再大一些時，
我會想要和她們談，
我會想要和她們談，
04:50
but for now, I look for ways to help them
identify what gives them pleasure
identify what gives them pleasure
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但，現在，我希望協助她們
認識愉悅的來源，
認識愉悅的來源，
04:54
and to practice articulating that.
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以及如何表達她們的需求。
04:58
"Rub my back," my daughter says
when I tuck her in.
when I tuck her in.
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當我哄女兒上床時，
她說：「揉搓我的背。」
她說：「揉搓我的背。」
05:01
And I say, "OK, how do you want me
to rub your back?"
to rub your back?"
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我說：「好，你希望
我怎麼揉搓你的背？」
我怎麼揉搓你的背？」
05:05
"I don't know," she says.
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她說：「我不知道。」
05:07
So I pause, waiting for her directions.
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所以我暫停下來，等她的指示。
05:10
Finally she says,
"OK, up and to the right,
"OK, up and to the right,
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終於，她說：「好，向上向右，
05:12
like you're tickling me."
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就像你在搔我癢一樣。」
05:14
I run my fingertips up her spine.
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我把我的指尖順著她的脊椎向上移。
05:16
"What else?" I ask.
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我問：「還有呢？」
05:18
"Over to the left, a little harder now."
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「移去左邊，現在再用力一點。」
05:21
We need to teach our children
how to articulate their sensations
how to articulate their sensations
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我們需要教導我們的孩子
如何清楚表達他們的感受，
如何清楚表達他們的感受，
05:25
so they're familiar with them.
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她們才知道如何表達。
05:27
I look for ways to play games
with my girls at home to do this.
with my girls at home to do this.
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我希望我可以和她們
在遊戲中達成這個目標。
在遊戲中達成這個目標。
05:30
I scratch my fingernails
on my daughter's arm and say,
on my daughter's arm and say,
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我用我的指甲抓我女兒的手臂，說：
05:33
"Give me one word to describe this."
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「用一個詞來形容這感覺。」
05:35
"Violent," she says.
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她說：「暴力。」
05:38
I embrace her, hold her tight.
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我擁抱她，緊緊摟著她。
05:40
"Protected," she tells me.
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她告訴我：「被保護著。」
05:43
I find opportunities
to tell them how I'm feeling,
to tell them how I'm feeling,
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我會找機會告訴她們我的感受、
05:46
what I'm experiencing,
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我的體驗，
05:47
so we have common language.
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我們才會有共通語言。
05:48
Like right now,
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就像現在，
05:50
this tingling in my scalp down my spine
means I'm nervous and I'm excited.
means I'm nervous and I'm excited.
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從頭皮延著脊椎一路下來的輕癢，
意味著我很緊張也很興奮。
意味著我很緊張也很興奮。
05:55
You are likely experiencing sensations
in response to me.
in response to me.
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你可能也會我的感受
而有些共鳴。
而有些共鳴。
05:59
The language I'm using,
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我使用的詞語、
06:01
the ideas I'm sharing.
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我分享的想法。
06:03
And our tendency
is to judge these reactions
is to judge these reactions
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我們傾向將這些感受分級，
06:06
and sort them into a hierarchy:
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把它們分類、分階層，
06:08
better or worse,
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較好的、較差的，
06:09
and then seek or avoid them.
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接著去尋求或避免它們。
06:12
And that's because we live
in this binary culture
in this binary culture
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那是因為我們住在二元文化中，
06:14
and we're taught from a very young age
to sort the world into good and bad.
to sort the world into good and bad.
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很小的時候，我們就被
教導要把世界分成善與惡。
教導要把世界分成善與惡。
06:19
"Did you like that book?"
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「你喜歡那本書嗎？」
06:21
"Did you have a good day?"
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「你今天過得好嗎？」
06:23
How about, "What did you
notice about that story?"
notice about that story?"
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為什麼不說「對那個故事，
你注意到什麼？」
你注意到什麼？」
06:26
"Tell me a moment about your day.
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「你今天有什麼特別的事。
06:28
What did you learn?"
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你從中學到什麼？」
06:30
Let's teach our children to stay open
and curious about their experiences,
and curious about their experiences,
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讓我們教導孩子
對他們的經驗體驗保持開放和好奇心，
對他們的經驗體驗保持開放和好奇心，
06:34
like a traveler in a foreign land.
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就像在異地的旅人。
06:38
And that way they can stay with sensation
without checking out --
without checking out --
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這麼一來，
他們就不會逃避自己的感覺－
他們就不會逃避自己的感覺－
06:42
even the heightened
and challenging ones --
and challenging ones --
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即使是很強烈很挑戰的感覺－
06:44
the way I did,
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不要像我以前那樣，
06:45
the way so many of us have.
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不要像我們許多人那樣。
06:47
This sense education,
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這種感覺教育，
06:49
this is education I want for my daughters.
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是我希望我女兒能接受的教育。
06:51
Sense education is what I needed as girl.
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我小時候需要的就是感覺教育。
06:55
It's what I hope for all of our children.
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我也希望所有我們的孩子都能得到。
06:58
This awareness of sensation,
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這種對於感覺的意識，
07:00
it's where we began as children.
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是我們身為孩子的起始點。
07:02
It's what we can learn from our children
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是我們能夠向孩子學習的東西，
07:05
and it's what we can
in turn remind our children
in turn remind our children
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也是我們能夠反過來
提醒她們的東西，
提醒她們的東西，
07:08
as they come of age.
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當她們逐日成長。
07:12
Thank you.
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謝謝你們。
07:13
(Applause)
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（掌聲）
ABOUT THE SPEAKER
Sue Jaye Johnson - Journalist, filmmaker, writerTED Resident Sue Jaye Johnson explores the ways cultural expectations shape our public and private behavior.
Why you should listen
Working across mediums, from radio, film, print and interactive media, Sue Jaye Johnson has investigated the US criminal justice system, women in sports, the legacy of apartheid and girls in South Africa. As a TED Resident, she is examining our current relationship with pleasure and sex through intimate interviews with people from all walks of life asking what they believe about sex and why. She is working on a book about rethinking how we talk about sexuality and sensuality fostered by this series of interviews.
Jaye is a two-time Peabody-winner and recipient of a Creative Capital award for her pioneering interactive documentary about US prisons. Her first feature film, T-Rex (PBS, Netflix) followed 17-year-old boxer Claressa Shields from Flint, Michigan to the gold medal at the London Olympics. Her work has been broadcast on PBS, NPR, WNY and published in the New York Times and The Washington Post.
She studied visual arts at Harvard University and interactive telecommunications at New York University. She lives in New York City with radio producer and frequent collaborator Joe Richman and their two daughters.
Sue Jaye Johnson | Speaker | TED.com